My 19 build begins in earnest - H811b arrives....

**voice of the theater** · September 3rd, 2016, 12:19 PM

Originally Posted by Coelacanth

Thanks for the comments VOT.

Interesting to hear that about the Z19's... everything I have read and re-read to date seemed to suggest they were superior to the original network.

Most Model 19 owners here on this forum prefer the original Model 19 crossover design over the Z-19. I know there are some people who like the Z-19 on other forums (and maybe some here), but I think the most important thing you need to keep in mind is that the guy who designed the Z-19 (Zilch) ended up using his Z-19 crossovers with non-Altec h.f. drivers because he himself couldn't get the Z-19 crossover to sound "right" with Altec h.f. drivers. This is documented in Zilch's own posts regarding the Z-19 crossovers. So, by Zilch's own example (and his posts regarding this crossover), the Z-19 is not ideally suited for use with Altec h.f. drivers. Keep in mind the original Model 19 crossover has high frequency EQ/compensation built in that makes it sound great with the 416/802-8g (or 416/902-8a) combination/specifically designed for this combination of ALTEC drivers. There are schematics on this forum to build the original Model 19 crossovers -- if you are building crossovers I'd suggest building ones that are intended for Altec drivers (and also happen to be recommended by people who actually own Model 19's!). GPA also sells Model 19 crossovers that are true to the original design AFAIK. If you're paying for shipping for drivers from GPA, they could put a pair of crossovers in the box and it would barely change the weight of the box/may not change the shipping price for your GPA driver order which means essentially free shipping for the crossovers with the purchase of GPA drivers/shipping. Of course building your own Model 19 crossovers from the original design/schematic is an option too.

**BillWojo** · September 3rd, 2016, 01:38 PM

I've been looking at building a set of Model 19 crossovers for my HeathKit AS 101's. It has a driver load very much like the Model 19. So far, pricing everything out the parts are coming to roughly 215.00 from Parts Express.
When I get some cash together I'll start a separate post with my parts list so that you folks can ok it. The inductors are where it gets confusing. I'm looking at Jantzen inductors, I think the 18 AWG ones will work but I'm unsure. Also there is no direct match for the 0.77mH inductor but they list a 0.75 mH inductor. I would think that it would be close enough.

BillWojo

**gdmoore28** · September 3rd, 2016, 03:40 PM

Originally Posted by BillWojo

I've been looking at building a set of Model 19 crossovers for my HeathKit AS 101's. It has a driver load very much like the Model 19. So far, pricing everything out the parts are coming to roughly 215.00 from Parts Express.
When I get some cash together I'll start a separate post with my parts list so that you folks can ok it. The inductors are where it gets confusing. I'm looking at Jantzen inductors, I think the 18 AWG ones will work but I'm unsure. Also there is no direct match for the 0.77mH inductor but they list a 0.75 mH inductor. I would think that it would be close enough.

BillWojo

Bill, I would very much appreciate it if you would indeed post your final Parts Express parts list once you have it all nailed down. Like Coelecanth, my build has been in the analysis/paralysis phase for quite some time now, but, like you, I've pretty much come to the conclusion that the original Model 19 crossover design may be the way to go with a Model 19-based build. As you noted, it's a very versatile crossover made specifically for the Altec drivers. I've driven myself half crazy trying to decide which crossover design to use for my 416/802/511B project, and I haven't ruled out using the original model 19 design. Having that parts list in hand would be great time-saver for many of us. Thanks in advance.
GeeDeeEmm

**Coelacanth** · September 3rd, 2016, 08:48 PM

Originally Posted by voice of the theater

Most Model 19 owners here on this forum prefer the original Model 19 crossover design over the Z-19. I know there are some people who like the Z-19 on other forums (and maybe some here), but I think the most important thing you need to keep in mind is that the guy who designed the Z-19 (Zilch) ended up using his Z-19 crossovers with non-Altec h.f. drivers because he himself couldn't get the Z-19 crossover to sound "right" with Altec h.f. drivers. This is documented in Zilch's own posts regarding the Z-19 crossovers. So, by Zilch's own example (and his posts regarding this crossover), the Z-19 is not ideally suited for use with Altec h.f. drivers. Keep in mind the original Model 19 crossover has high frequency EQ/compensation built in that makes it sound great with the 416/802-8g (or 416/902-8a) combination/specifically designed for this combination of ALTEC drivers. There are schematics on this forum to build the original Model 19 crossovers -- if you are building crossovers I'd suggest building ones that are intended for Altec drivers (and also happen to be recommended by people who actually own Model 19's!). GPA also sells Model 19 crossovers that are true to the original design AFAIK. If you're paying for shipping for drivers from GPA, they could put a pair of crossovers in the box and it would barely change the weight of the box/may not change the shipping price for your GPA driver order which means essentially free shipping for the crossovers with the purchase of GPA drivers/shipping. Of course building your own Model 19 crossovers from the original design/schematic is an option too.

Thanks for this. I take all of your points - and apologise if my original response seemed like a brush-off. Your words carry much weight, as does the collective experience of A19 owners.

It would certainly be simpler to get the GPA-recreated xo's. I guess with that taken care of I would only really have the cabinetry and horn building to take care of.

More to be said but busy working on copy router..

**BillWojo** · September 4th, 2016, 12:03 AM

gdmoore28, I have started a thread, look for "Proposed Parts List for Model 19 Crossover". I'm also looking for input on that from the more technically astute members as I have some questions in that post as well.
I think the parts I have picked out are as good or better than the parts used on the stock crossovers that Altec built over 30 years ago. You can upgrade caps, inductors, probably find other things to push the cost of these crossovers well past the $1000.00 mark. The parts I picked out will keep it in the 215.00 range. Possible upgrades in the inductors, maybe, but even that wouldn't cost but an additional $50.00.
I think that it was a good idea to start a thread about building the Model 19 crossovers as I haven't come across anything that covers it well. Seems to be a popular crossover that does a lot very well.

BillWojo