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Thread: 817 question

  1. #31
    Senior Hostboard Member Mustang Marvin's Avatar
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    Re: 817 question

    By really big, how many cubic feet?

    Should it be horns as well or just a flat baffle mount?

    Next would be of course the port diameter and length.

    xo specs. 2nd. order?

    500 Hz? 800 Hz.?

    Size is not a concern at this point. Performance is.

    Thanks,
    MM

  2. #32
    Senior Hostboard Member GM's Avatar
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    Re: 817 question

    Working on it as time permits, but 'ultimate' is dependent on a number of factors with the end user's hearing being the most dominant and the one variable that nobody but the individual can determine, so all I can do is recommend big enough to allow the drivers to 'breathe' and you to have some [EQ], port tuning flexibility to hopefully find your own 'ultimate' in room response or at least obviously better overall than any Altec PA/consumer speaker ever offered for sale.

    The first thing I noticed about your room though is the left side door precludes doing a simple triangular cab, so will need mirror image builds.

    Also, is that a suspended ceiling?

    Still ideally need seated ear height since horns beam enough in the HF to have very narrow 'sweet spots', making vertical location a bit 'tricky' best best overall results.

    GM
    Loud is Beautiful if it's Clean! As always though, the usual disclaimers apply to this post's contents.

  3. #33
    Senior Hostboard Member Mustang Marvin's Avatar
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    Re: 817 question

    Thanks GM,
    Your input is always appreciated.
    The door opens away from the speaker. In other words you push to open it.
    Maybe I got carried away with saying the ultimate speaker box.
    I was thinking of maybe a double horn base reflex type enclosure. Something like a 828 box with dual 416's. or something similar. If that would require too large of a box, then maybe a flat front baffle. I still think a base reflex would be the way to go.

    I think my major concern is the cu ft. with a double bass driver configuration. I have the set-up for determing port size. Audio generator and vtm with chart. It's been awhile since I did the calculations, but I have instructions.

    I know I could just build an A7, but I don't know how that would work with two drivers. The high comp horn would be tilted toward my ears and sit on top of the enclosure.

    Thanks,
    Marvin

  4. #34
    HB Super Moderator
    817 question


    Altec Best's Avatar
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    Re: 817 question

    Quote Originally Posted by LowOhms View Post
    Oh My Goodness, mah again.

    Its hard to know if mah is just trying to attack me on his post, ( as he has been initiating - the last several days ), or if he actually believes what he wrote and posted, which is a dis-service to any serious ALTEC user !!

    All agree, GM knows his stuff on design, but thats not the point here.

    You have to get the wiring done optimally through out your existing implementation, before complaining about bass, and going to new designs - using the same wire as you have now!!

    The chain is as strong as its weakest link. I have identified a weak link in any ALTEC system WE can resolve on our own. 'Offered precise, thought - out answers to the problem. Its like that small I.D. fuel line Marvin, to the vintage motorcycle's motor.

    14 AWG solid core to an ALTEC woofer leaves performance gaps, versus the specific suggestions offered. If you THINK about that, one should intuitively know this, or at least, I would hope people know. Have fun !! I do.

    Jeff Medwin Low Ohms
    Quote Originally Posted by mah View Post
    Jeff, My post only contained statements of FACT. They were addressed to Mustang Marvin.

    But now you have jumped in I would love to see the verifiable supporting evidence behind the myriad advice you proffer on this forum.
    Enough of this pissing match guys !

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Mustang Marvin View Post
    Jesse! Where did I go wrong here? This is one reason I haven't posted in a long time. No need to get all pissy here. I just wanted to get a little help, not start an argument.

    I will consider all recommendations and make my decision based on that. Thanks for the POSITIVE input.

    Now, can we get back to my original question PLEASE.

    If you were going to build the ultimate bass enclosure using 2 416's per box, what would it be?
    Thanks again,
    MM
    Hi Marvin it's good to see you again.. A 20 cubic foot MLTL corner loaded dual 416 box !

  5. #35
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    817 question


    Phil-G's Avatar
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    Re: 817 question

    Quote Originally Posted by Altec Best View Post
    Hi Marvin it's good to see you again.. A 20 cubic foot MLTL corner loaded dual 416 box !
    telephone booths can still be found at a reasonable price.
    Sonic Barbarian

  6. #36
    Senior Hostboard Member Mustang Marvin's Avatar
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    Re: 817 question

    20 cf. isn't all that big. Any idea where I can get plans for that big boy?

  7. #37
    Senior Hostboard Member 604man's Avatar
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    Re: 817 question

    Quote Originally Posted by Mustang Marvin View Post
    20 cf. isn't all that big. Any idea where I can get plans for that big boy?
    Go into Search and look for "604-8g big cabinets big sound"

    these cabs are 21 cu ft and the dimensions are 33" X 53" which is
    known as the golden ratio.....check it out.

    ....GC

  8. #38
    Senior Hostboard Member LowOhms's Avatar
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    Re: 817 question

    Quote Originally Posted by 604man View Post
    Go into Search and look for "604-8g big cabinets big sound"

    these cabs are 21 cu ft and the dimensions are 33" X 53" which is
    known as the golden ratio.....check it out.

    ....GC
    Ohhh, I LIKE Golden Ratio dimensions.

    My audio chassis lengths and widths on amps have been that ratio, last 15 years.

    My best friend's GPA 604 MLTLs are Golden Ratio dimension ratios also.

    I also try to dissipate plate Watts of Final's tubes at Golden Ratio proportions. Finals tubes last forever " so to speak " and they lose the STRESSED sound I hear when the dissipations are hot-rodded close to the plates maximum ( eg: a 2A3 at 250 VDC P-K and at 60 mA., commonly used, sounds stressed there ).

    Amp photos taken today 9-27-2016.

    Jeff Medwin Low Ohms
    Last edited by LowOhms; September 27th, 2016 at 08:14 PM.

  9. #39
    Senior Hostboard Member LowOhms's Avatar
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    Re: 817 question

    Quote Originally Posted by Phil-G View Post
    telephone booths can still be found at a reasonable price.
    FREE, if you have big Dykes and no one is looking !!

    Jeff Medwin Low Ohms

  10. #40
    Senior Hostboard Member tomt's Avatar
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    Re: 817 question

    Quote Originally Posted by Mustang Marvin View Post

    A question for the more experienced members.
    If you had 4, 416's and wanted to build the ultimate bass enclosure, what would you build?
    a pair of these.

    not kidding.




    " My intention for the design was to try and achieve true 20Hz.
    horn loaded response without resorting to techniques like using a low Fs heavy cone woofer.
    This can work, but I wanted a really clean sound without the boom or hangover of a large moving mass.
    On recordings like pipe organ with true low frequency content, the BB sounds the closest to real that I have heard. "

    - steve schell





    The "Big Bottom Sub" Patio System

    whole thread -

    The "Big Bottom Sub" Patio System
    guns kill people,

    like spoons made rush limbaugh,

    fat ....

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