Page 1 of 6 123456 LastLast
Results 1 to 10 of 57

Thread: Basis of belief

  1. #1
    Guest 's Avatar

    Basis of belief

    Many peole have different beliefs on different things. I once started a post about homosexuality. Let it be known that one of my best friends has repented for this behavior. SO I am not being judgemental. I believe everyone should base their believe on something... I base mine on the Bible. I have ask many and they just say that they believe this or that.. and then I ask them why and they say just because.. that is what I believe. So I will give you some scripture to support why I believe being homosexual is wrong. After I do this I would like to see what your base is to why you believe what you believe.

    Genesis 19:5-8
    5 They called to Lot, "Where are the men who came to you tonight? Bring them out to us so that we can have sex with them."

    6 Lot went outside to meet them and shut the door behind him 7 and said, "No, my friends. Don't do this wicked thing. 8 Look, I have two daughters who have never slept with a man. Let me bring them out to you, and you can do what you like with them. But don't do anything to these men, for they have come under the protection of my roof."

    Leviticus 18:22
    22 " 'Do not lie with a man as one lies with a woman; that is detestable.


    Leviticus 20:13
    13 " 'If a man lies with a man as one lies with a woman, both of them have done what is detestable. They must be put to death; their blood will be on their own heads.

    Judges 19:22
    22 While they were enjoying themselves, some of the wicked men of the city surrounded the house. Pounding on the door, they shouted to the old man who owned the house, "Bring out the man who came to your house so we can have sex with him."
    ( Read carefully it says the men were evil)

    1 Corinthians 6:9
    9Do you not know that the wicked will not inherit the kingdom of God? Do not be deceived: Neither the sexually immoral nor idolaters nor adulterers nor male prostitutes nor homosexual offenders (Apostle Paul said this not Pac-Man)

    This is just a few scriptures to support what and why I believe what I do. If you have any questions or comments please feel free to make them known. If you do not believe this please fill us in why you believe what you believe about this topic. THank you.

  2. #2
    Inactive Member CoeburnCane's Avatar
    Join Date
    August 24th, 2004
    Posts
    4,931
    Follows
    0
    Following
    0
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    Quoted
    0 Post(s)

    Re: Basis of belief

    Here's a very good lesson--don't parse 1 verse here or there--the Bible is a narrative, and while quotes/verses from that narrative are nice, in order to get the full meaning, it must be taken as a whole part. First off--I don't disagree with you. I disagree w/your logic on this and how it's presented--bear w/me.

    I went and read 1 Corinthians 6:9, and the verses around it as well:

    <div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body"> 9Know ye not that the unrighteous shall not inherit the Kingdom of God? Be not deceived: Neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor the effeminate, nor abusers of themselves with mankind,

    10nor thieves, nor the covetous, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor extortioners shall inherit the Kingdom of God.


    11And such were some of you. But ye are washed, ye are sanctified, ye are justified in the name of the Lord Jesus and by the Spirit of our God.


    12"All things are lawful unto me," but all things are not expedient. "All things are lawful for me," but I will not be brought under the power of any.


    13"Meats for the belly, and the belly for meats," but God shall destroy both it and them. Now the body is not for fornication, but for the Lord; and the Lord for the body.


    14And God hath both raised up the Lord and will also raise up us by His own power.


    15Know ye not that your bodies are the members of Christ? Shall I then take the members of Christ and make them the members of a harlot? God forbid!


    16What? Know ye not that he who is joined to a harlot is one body with her? "For two," saith He, "shall be one flesh."
    </div></div>

    Note the difference in translations from your scripture to this 21st Century King James Version. Not only does it say directly male prostitutes or homosexual offenders (which are both very modern bits of terminology). I'm not saying that's not what it means, I'm saying that most likely Paul did not use that wording, and may have not meant EXACTLY the same thing as the modern translation does. We have to be careful with translations down through the years, I know you're well aware of that.

    Also, note in verses 15 & 16 how the disdain for being with a "harlot". IMO--Lot is welcoming the men who are looking to have sex with the men under his roof to do this very thing by offering his daughters up for sexual use. Lot was a very pious man, but I feel this may have been a human mistake on his part as it goes against another warning that Paul had made to the church at Corinth (hundreds of years after Sodom & Gommorah, mind you). He was basically asking them to trade in one sin for the other, like one was worse than the other. Sleeping with a strange woman or "harlot" is no different than sleeping with a man, the Bible states both are sinful, and all sin is equal in the eyes of God.

    BTW--the 11th verse in 1 Corinthians 6 is the most important as it is the most merciful and full of good news regarding these sins--that they can be repented of and forgiven. That's where the focus should be in conversations like this, I think, not on how shameful the sins are, but that they can be forgiven just as any other sin. That's important to those who sin.

    Also, some would argue that Leviticus is under the old law and was done away with when Christ came to earth, so that those verses are a moot point. Some would--I'm not, but some would.

    To be exceptionally clear, I'm not disagreeing, just pointing out some weak points in your presentation, that's all.
    [U][COLOR=#22229c][IMG]http://i20.photobucket.com/albums/b242/btketron/miami-med.gif[/IMG][IMG]http://i20.photobucket.com/albums/b242/btketron/nohokie-med.gif[/IMG][/COLOR][/U]
    [U][COLOR=#22229c][IMG]http://i20.photobucket.com/albums/b242/btketron/Funny/owmyballs.gif[/IMG][/COLOR][/U]

  3. #3
    Guest 's Avatar

    Re: Basis of belief

    Cane thanks for the wisdom. I believe we should read the whole scripture to get the full meaning.... but we were discussing Homosexuality. Yes drunkards, covetous.. and others wwere listed in there. I agree that sin is sin in Gods eyes and he will forgive any sin if we have remorse and ask for forgiveness. There are different translations but would you not agree that there is not a Christian translation out there that supports not condones this behavior. Sleeping with a harlot is wrong yes.. and was Lot trading in sin for another sin.. like one was worse or something? Well we as people sometimes want to say some things are worse than others but in reality.. in Gods eyes they are not.Just because Lev.. is under the law does not mean that it is not the truth... When the New Testament came along it did not do away with the Old... IS there anywhere in the NT that supports homosexuality? Homosexuality just like any other is a sin and the good news is that God loves us and will forgive us. I have to repent for things al the time.. that might seem like small things but they are still sin in the eyes of god. My life is a life of repentance... so thank od for his forgiveness!

  4. #4
    Inactive Member jtw61194's Avatar
    Join Date
    February 20th, 2006
    Posts
    873
    Follows
    0
    Following
    0
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    Quoted
    0 Post(s)

    Re: Basis of belief

    Mark Bingham was a passenger on United Flight 93. I believe there was a movie and several documentaries made about this flight and what happened to it. The act of attempting to overthrow the hijackers has been referred to as the U.S. first battle in the war on terror. It has been reported, pretty extensively I believe, that Mark Bigham was very influential in this attempt. He was a homosexual. How does he stand in God's eyes?

  5. #5
    Guest 's Avatar

    Re: Basis of belief

    <div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: 82abn</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Mark Bingham was a passenger on United Flight 93. I believe there was a movie and several documentaries made about this flight and what happened to it. The act of attempting to overthrow the hijackers has been referred to as the U.S. first battle in the war on terror. It has been reported, pretty extensively I believe, that Mark Bigham was very influential in this attempt. He was a homosexual. How does he stand in God's eyes? </div></div>

    Yes I am familiar with the story. It was a great thing that he done. What we have to understand is this... how does one recieve eternal life? There are many views on this but I will share mine... There is only one way to eternal life and that is through Jesus Christ. There are a lot of good people in this world that do similar things and some even greater but that will not get us to heaven according to scripture. I agree he was influental in leading the peole to do what they done... I am sure he was a great person.... but sorry to say 82abn none of us will get to heaven because we are good peole. I do not know where he stood with God.. so I cannot be his judge. What I can say is according to scripture God does not support being a homosexual.. so therefor just as any other sin there must be repentance. I hope that answered your question.

  6. #6
    Inactive Member jtw61194's Avatar
    Join Date
    February 20th, 2006
    Posts
    873
    Follows
    0
    Following
    0
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    Quoted
    0 Post(s)

    Re: Basis of belief

    When I ask this, please understand that I'm not trying to be argumentative. Imagine that! What if we were talking about another passenger who cussed every other word and never asked repentence. Would he follow the same footsteps as the homosexual? I did some reading yesterday on the Westboro Baptist Church homepage(www.godhatesfags.com). I don't know if you all are familiar with this group. They are the ones who picket killed soldier's funerals and I believe they were planning on picketing some of the murdered VT victims. They carry picket signs that say, "God Hates Fags!" and a lot of other pretty raunchy stuff. They have all the scripture that says what they are doing is good and Christian, but is filled with so much hate and venom. Do they read the same Bible and belong to the same denomination as you? This is where religion confuses me. I was taught that you should be loving and compassionate to your fellow people and these people seem to do the exact opposite. And they quote scriptures, also. So, what gives?

  7. #7
    Inactive Member imported_ut1's Avatar
    Join Date
    July 16th, 2002
    Posts
    1,654
    Follows
    0
    Following
    0
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    Quoted
    0 Post(s)

    Re: Basis of belief

    The people you're taking about are about as much Christian in their behavior as I am Muslim in mine. They create a huge problem for those of us who try to preach and teach that God loves all of us, (even homosexuals!)and sent His Son to pay the price for ALL sin, even the sin of homosex. God doesn't hate the "fag", He hates the sin. But He hates any and all sin!!
    I imagine (imagine now, mind you) that if Jesus were to speak to this group He would do as He did to another group and cry out "Hypocrits!" I also imagine that He would take this group back to the writing He was doing in the dirt when the woman caught in the act of adultery was brought to Him. "He that is without sin...."
    To me, this group is the perfect example of the "holier than thou" mindset that I detest. Our first realization as a Christian must be that we are saved from the penalty of sin. That realization must be accompanied by the very real fact that we are not exempt from the consequences of sin.
    The big difference between the "saved" Christian and the "lost" sinner is that the sinner is not saved from that aforementioned penalty of sin, and the saved has made an arrangement with God to pay for his/her sins while the lost has not.
    Quoting scripture is one thing, living it is quite another. Those people are definitely NOT living it! [img]/LDPforum/ubbthreads/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/laugh.gif[/img]
    "Yes, there are two paths you can go by
    But in the long run
    There's still time to change the road you're on."

  8. #8
    Inactive Member jtw61194's Avatar
    Join Date
    February 20th, 2006
    Posts
    873
    Follows
    0
    Following
    0
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    Quoted
    0 Post(s)

    Re: Basis of belief

    Great reply and thank you for your insight. But, do you see where I was going with this particular question and example? These people back up their beliefs with scripture and the Church, as they know it. I mean, who is right?

  9. #9
    Inactive Member yankeebaseball's Avatar
    Join Date
    April 2nd, 2007
    Posts
    1,387
    Follows
    0
    Following
    0
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    Quoted
    0 Post(s)

    Re: Basis of belief

    You can take anything out of context. The Klan uses scripture often to justify their actions.
    I have a question, not for anyone just your opinions. What about the Crusades? Whats anyones opinions on that? I know I had a discusssion with one of my best friends, on how the saying "Gods Will" was used.
    Nothing but the process is infinite
    Eternal, endless, indefinite

  10. #10
    Inactive Member imported_ut1's Avatar
    Join Date
    July 16th, 2002
    Posts
    1,654
    Follows
    0
    Following
    0
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    Quoted
    0 Post(s)

    Re: Basis of belief

    The Bible teaches us to "try the spirits, whether they are of God" (1 John 4:1). At the side of every Christian, Satan is whispering. He is whispering doubt, hate, and self-righteousness. Many things have been done in God's name that were not of God. Saul thought he was doing God a service by arresting, prosecuting, and yes, even executing believers (Stephen immediately comes to mind). Of course we know the rest of the story and how he became a Christian whose name was changed to Paul and developed into one of God's champions in evangelizing and instructing the church in proper conduct.
    The most difficult part of being a Christian is assertaining what God wants out of your life. There's only one way you can know that, and that is to get as close to Him as you can. Think about it. How best to hear someone, when they are right next to you or several yards away? Its the same with trying to hear what God has to say to you. If you want know what He has to say, you have to be close to Him, you must read and study His word, you must have daily conversations with Him, and you must busy yourself about being in His house to worship with fellow believers. God is not the author of confusion, and any body of believers who promote such hatred as what has been mentioned are being led by a spirit other than God.
    "Yes, there are two paths you can go by
    But in the long run
    There's still time to change the road you're on."

Page 1 of 6 123456 LastLast

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •