Evangelicans?

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Originally Posted by Gotch

Actually it's apples and apples. Hitler made it abundantly clear that his master race goals and the resulting extermination of Jews, Gypsies, Slavs, homosexuals, etc. was based soundly in Darwinism. Stalin was not so vocal about it, but the writings of people who knew him in his late teens and early twenties seems to strongly suggest that Darwin was the primary influence to his actions.

So, did Darwinism kill these people, or did twisted individuals use Darwinism as an excuse or a vehicle for action they were responsible for?

Christ was about not hurting one another, doing violence in the name of the religion that bares his name is the sole responsibility of those individuals who perpetrate the violence.

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LOL Evolution and evolutionary racism isn't the same thing. One is Darwin's theory, the other is an insane and unscientific eugenics theory. He also was a firm believer in an Aryan Jesus, that'd seem to make just as much sense for his motivation. I get what you're saying man, but these things in the Bible were just as they sound and were accepted by God.

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Originally Posted by valour

Things in Genesis aare still there. God is the Alpha and Omega. The Ten commandments are still a part of God's precepts. What this means is that we no longer have to answer to the law, because the law leads to death, but now through Jesus Christ we have Grace and Mercy.

If you will look at it correctly that was the law the governed Israel, God's chosen people at that time. Evil was rampant and God gave them many chances to turn from their evil ways, but they chose not to. We can thank God today that the blood of Christ covers our sin and we can receive forgiveness.

God has been very clear after the atonement we received from the blood of Christ that was shed.

The Bible proclaims that there is no other name by which man can be saved other than Jesus Christ. I would suggest that you do a study into the things that you mentioned happening in the Old Testament. Hermeneutics is the study of interpretation theory , there are rules ot interpretation. You must consider the context in which it is written and what the people practiced and accepted at that time. Their History, culture, and culture are things you have to consider while reading and drawing a conclusion.

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And the bad things are still there too, you can't have it both ways, accept one thing and not the other. They all came from the same time, so should we write the Ten Commandments off too? I do, because they're mostly about worshiping him and they are put where they don't need to be. But I don't think a believer feels the same. There's not really a "context" issue, most verses are pretty clear with the rest using words that are not common now, but a simple search can take care of that problem. Nothing like the things I mentioned are acceptable in any way, that's like me saying Muhammad's relationship with young girls was okay because it was okay during that time.


The Bible is full of fallacies and you can find most of it in other stories before it. There was several Jesus's so to speak, having the same exact story, but hundreds to thousands of years before he was here...anyone want to explain that? Or how the Epic of Gilgamesh is so similar to the Bible, but before it?

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Originally Posted by R13

LOL Evolution and evolutionary racism isn't the same thing. One is Darwin's theory, the other is an insane and unscientific eugenics theory. He also was a firm believer in an Aryan Jesus, that'd seem to make just as much sense for his motivation. I get what you're saying man, but these things in the Bible were just as they sound and were accepted by God.

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You see, that was my exact point. All you have to do now is replace evolution with Christian. Thank you.

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Originally Posted by R13

The Bible is full of fallacies and you can find most of it in other stories before it. There was several Jesus's so to speak, having the same exact story, but hundreds to thousands of years before he was here...anyone want to explain that? Or how the Epic of Gilgamesh is so similar to the Bible, but before it?

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I've been through this at least a hundred times. Practically no real scholars accept this position but it has risen out of the same camp as the historical Jesus never existed argument. Pretty far out stuff.

My time will be limited (putting a roof on my house) so it might be best if I simply direct you to the best online source for information on this. Very detailed with every I dotted and every T crossed.

Genesis merely a rip-off of other ANE lit

Btw, the guy at the infidels site who was responsible several years ago for starting the whole modern "Jesus never existed" fad has admitted that he firmly believes a historical Jesus did exist lol.

Just a side note....

What I'm curious about is why, when something like this happens and Christians have their religion abused and used for obvious evil--why don't Christians get just as mad/madder than the rest of society? I kind of expected that out of this thread, but instead it's turned into a deconstruction of OT vs. NT to try to somehow justify (?) what happened.

These "churches" used Christianity as an excuse to do heinous things. Where's the outrage? Where's the outcry to religious leaders to call these terrible human beings to the carpet for standing behind Christianity as a shield to do sinful things?

To me, it's false prophets like this that should really be taken to task by the core of Christianity today as opposed to homosexuals who want to get married, for instance.

The death of children in the name of Christianity pisses me off a lot worse than a whole lot of banners the religious right movements want to take on today.

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Originally Posted by Gotch

I've been through this at least a hundred times. Practically no real scholars accept this position but it has risen out of the same camp as the historical Jesus never existed argument. Pretty far out stuff.

My time will be limited (putting a roof on my house) so it might be best if I simply direct you to the best online source for information on this. Very detailed with every I dotted and every T crossed.

Genesis merely a rip-off of other ANE lit

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When did I say he never existed? I think he did historically, but a divine being? Nope. Maybe a very controversial teacher that was made a martyr, he needed a good story, so you collect the ones of "gods" before him.

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Originally Posted by R13

LOL Evolution and evolutionary racism isn't the same thing. One is Darwin's theory, the other is an insane and unscientific eugenics theory. He also was a firm believer in an Aryan Jesus, that'd seem to make just as much sense for his motivation. I get what you're saying man, but these things in the Bible were just as they sound and were accepted by God.




And the bad things are still there too, you can't have it both ways, accept one thing and not the other. They all came from the same time, so should we write the Ten Commandments off too? I do, because they're mostly about worshiping him and they are put where they don't need to be. But I don't think a believer feels the same. There's not really a "context" issue, most verses are pretty clear with the rest using words that are not common now, but a simple search can take care of that problem. Nothing like the things I mentioned are acceptable in any way, that's like me saying Muhammad's relationship with young girls was okay because it was okay during that time.


The Bible is full of fallacies and you can find most of it in other stories before it. There was several Jesus's so to speak, having the same exact story, but hundreds to thousands of years before he was here...anyone want to explain that? Or how the Epic of Gilgamesh is so similar to the Bible, but before it?

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The lie of survival of the fittest was twisted by Hitler, I believe that. Anyway. If we jsut obey this commandment the ten are fulfilled. Love thy Lord thy God with all your heart and your neighbor likewise. Who are you to analize the Bible and say what should be where? lol.

Please present what you believe to be fallacies?:)

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Originally Posted by CoeburnCane

What I'm curious about is why, when something like this happens and Christians have their religion abused and used for obvious evil--why don't Christians get just as mad/madder than the rest of society? I kind of expected that out of this thread, but instead it's turned into a deconstruction of OT vs. NT to try to somehow justify (?) what happened.

These "churches" used Christianity as an excuse to do heinous things. Where's the outrage? Where's the outcry to religious leaders to call these terrible human beings to the carpet for standing behind Christianity as a shield to do sinful things?

To me, it's false prophets like this that should really be taken to task by the core of Christianity today as opposed to homosexuals who want to get married, for instance.

The death of children in the name of Christianity pisses me off a lot worse than a whole lot of banners the religious right movements want to take on today.

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I am outraged that this happened, sorry I forget to voice that. I am also outraged that an atheist would attempt to use it to pin this on true Christians. We all know that that is a false doctrine, but what can we do about it if that type of behavior is accepted there where the boy lived? The only way to stop this is spread truth, but then a person must accept it. I do believe this is a very important issue, so if you have any suggestions as to how to do anyhting other than to speak out against it I am all ears.

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Originally Posted by Gotch

Actually it's apples and apples. Hitler made it abundantly clear that his master race goals and the resulting extermination of Jews, Gypsies, Slavs, homosexuals, etc. was based soundly in Darwinism. Stalin was not so vocal about it, but the writings of people who knew him in his late teens and early twenties seems to strongly suggest that Darwin was the primary influence to his actions.

So, did Darwinism kill these people, or did twisted individuals use Darwinism as an excuse or a vehicle for action they were responsible for?

Christ was about not hurting one another, doing violence in the name of the religion that bares his name is the sole responsibility of those individuals who perpetrate the violence.

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Yes, you are 100% right.

That is true, then why does the United States keep crusading against Islam?
Islam is not about hurting people, not anymore than Christianity is.
Any terrorist attacks done in the name of Islam should not be held against Islam, correct?

btw Gotch this isnt about you per se, ive never seen you condemn Islam, but I have heard numerous Christians spew hatred about Islam for doing the same kind of things extreme Christian radicals have done throughout history.

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Originally Posted by valour

The lie of survival of the fittest was twisted by Hitler, I believe that. Anyway. If we jsut obey this commandment the ten are fulfilled. Love thy Lord thy God with all your heart and your neighbor likewise. Who are you to analize the Bible and say what should be where? lol.

Please present what you believe to be fallacies?:)

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Don't need any of them IMO. Good people know not to steal, lie, kill, be good to each other etc. No religion makes a person a better one. It doesn't take an expert to analyze the Bible and see what's wrong with it, #1 it was written by men, that they could put whatever they want in there and no one is suppose to question it. Ever find it odd that whenever God speaks to someone, its in private? Never to a group of people, I always found that suspect. And there isn't much truth in there, what's been proven? No adam and eve, no flood/ark, degrades women, the earth doesn't have corners, no one that wrote it ever even met jesus...which those miracles of his never proven to have happen, Thomas Jefferson agrees. Its an old book that's taken too seriously, too far and been used as a tool along with most religions to do harm. World would be a lot better off without it.