Officiating

**pvfan** · January 4th, 2008, 01:24 AM

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body"> I can't help but think that is the reason you go versus Gate City, get hand-checked the entire night, and they get called for it 2-3 times if you're lucky, and normally in the fourth. I appreciate the fact that they have good athletes, they exploit that, they exploit getting in your face, and as I've heard more than one official say, and I think we all have, if we called that, we would be here all night. I appreciate that nobody wants a 60 free throw shooting night, but if you don't call it, don't you penalize the 'team that doesn't perform at a certain level'? </div></div>

What he said.

**CoeburnCane** · January 4th, 2008, 09:53 AM

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: 1inStripes</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I like your idea, but really basketball is the only sport that this is remotely feasible. </div></div>

Then why not do it? Basketball is likely the most badly officiated sport in the area, and it needs some special attention. I think if the association was serious about improving that, and getting rid of the stigma that they just don't care about improving (which is a real belief a lot of people have in the area), then they'd do it if it were even "remotely feasible".

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: 1inStripes</div><div class="ubbcode-body">For most, the best situation would be to have game reviews as UKCats1 mentioned. Its basically what happens at the upper levels. </div></div>

We've done what's good "for most" (I'm assuming most implies officials), and they've abused the bball officiating duties and plainly haven't gotten any better--that's why refs get bad knocks, not because teams/towns have vendettas for no reason. This forces those refs hands that are just laying back calling whatever and drawing the pay for each game they can get and not giving all they've got to get better.

**1inStripes** · January 4th, 2008, 10:16 AM

The "for most" meant the most opportunities to improve how games are called, not most officials. Im not saying it is a bad thing to do. I like the idea. But how many of these camps will you set up, at how many locations? I guarantee you that very few coaches would even attend, much less a principal. Coaches generally send one of their lower teir assistants IMO to most of the mandated state clinics, plus it might surprise you how many coaches do not know the rules very well either. It really would be up to the comissioner and officials anyway then.

I agree that all officials should strive to do a better job each and every game no matter who is playing. Don't think I am trying to defend those who don't try to improve, and/or don't care.

**1inStripes** · January 4th, 2008, 10:19 AM

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: PVFAN</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I was watching the NFL Network last night and it showed how they graded their officials. The highest ranking crews went to the playoffs, they reviewed the game film and awarded and deducted points accordingly. </div></div>

Yeah I try to watch the "Official Review" each week. Its a really good show even though not everything pertains to the HS level.

**imported_UKCats1** · January 4th, 2008, 10:25 AM

Cane I like your idea and feel that could work, but like Stripes said it would be feasible in basketball. I think in football you need to have more position oriented seminars or clinics rather than a mass meeting. I would love to see an Umpire clinic, LJ and Linesman Clinic, Back Judge Clinic, and a Referee Clinic. That way all of the officials in football could be on the same page on how to do things. We could do these clinics on the same day at the same location just break up into groups. You would probably need more than one session to get done what you need to because some officials work more than one position. I am a referee for the most part but during playoffs will work other spots including referee.

Rock I am not trying to say that a team should get special privilege because they may be an upper tier team I am saying that they generally do not make the dumb mistake that a younger team might make. I am not trying to throw off on any team or players I am just saying that any given year any team may be down a little and not as talented or just young and they make more mental mistakes that you have to deal with that is what makes officiating a little harder.

When I am out there I hope that I am not noticed but when I am noticed I want to make sure I get the call right. For officials to get better it takes a personal commitment and an open mind. If you are closed minded and resistant to change then you are not going to get any better. I try to watch as much tape as I can to get better and make myself a better official. Now all I need to do is lose this spare tire around my waist.

**1inStripes** · January 4th, 2008, 10:45 AM

Ditto to all of that. Well, other than the referee part. Generally back judge instead.

**centennialdawg** · January 4th, 2008, 10:47 AM

AHHHH! But you do have the time and desire to get on here and complain about it.

**CoeburnCane** · January 4th, 2008, 10:57 AM

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: 1inStripes</div><div class="ubbcode-body">But how many of these camps will you set up, at how many locations? I guarantee you that very few coaches would even attend, much less a principal. Coaches generally send one of their lower teir assistants IMO to most of the mandated state clinics, plus it might surprise you how many coaches do not know the rules very well either. It really would be up to the comissioner and officials anyway then.</div></div>

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: UKCats1</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Cane I like your idea and feel that could work, but like Stripes said it would be feasible in basketball. I think in football you need to have more position oriented seminars or clinics rather than a mass meeting. I would love to see an Umpire clinic, LJ and Linesman Clinic, Back Judge Clinic, and a Referee Clinic. That way all of the officials in football could be on the same page on how to do things. We could do these clinics on the same day at the same location just break up into groups. You would probably need more than one session to get done what you need to because some officials work more than one position. I am a referee for the most part but during playoffs will work other spots including referee. </div></div>

In my original posting of the idea for basketball officiating mandatory clinics, I said 3-4 a year. I wouldn't think if an official was serious about being a basketball official for the upcoming year and wanted to know the rules better, plus get physical reps in during the off-season for that sport, that once a quarter would be too much to ask--one full weekend, Saturday/Sunday, somewhere where they can have 8 hour sessions each day. Have 4 full length games each day, and depending upon # of refs there, they can rotate crews each quarter to give every one a chance. I'm not sure how many bball officials the AOA has, but I think something like that would give every official at least 1 full quarter of live officiating and time for the commish and other officials to critique their performance and give them things to work on. Hell, do it at one of the bigger gyms--Castlewood, VA High, Lebanon, etc...so you can get as many officials there as possible.

As for coaches not showing up to some of these mandatory things, I guarantee you if there was a concerted effort like that made by the coaches and they knew it would help them better understand the rules AND result in better officiating when they put their teams on the floor that they'd show up with bells on. If the commish made a concerted effort to express that they need them there in order to get their input to make basketball better in the region, then they'd be there.

**1inStripes** · January 4th, 2008, 11:00 AM

Honestly, it might surprise you.

**Slobber Knocker** · January 4th, 2008, 11:14 AM

Guys, I let every official know about this back in the summer:

2007 VHSL Basketball Officials Camp at VCU in Richmond, Va.
July 16-19, 2007.........$110, includes meals and board!
Website........http://www.vhsl.org/Basketball/2007_camp.pdf
Get out of the mountains and learn!

Also the camp at Gardner-Webb back in June.
Yes, I was at both camps!

"Oh its too far for me to travel!"" WaaaWaaaWaa! All of the trip is a tax write off!

If you want to get better; they play some very good basktball out in Richmond at this camp; they will tape you and critique you as well.
Pride is why these "older" refs do not go to the camps because they "know it all." I have said it before, the older you get, the harder you have to work, Basketball players stay the same age.....refs get older!
Hell, I had Shupe as a ref back in 82, 83, 84. You think he will EVER attend a camp? Only if he is an instructor! HAHAHA! Too arrogant and too much pride.