Thanks, Henry.
He's obviously got some skill.
I'd like to hear him play to
some music. I'm sure he could
do fine.
There's something about playing
to someone elses tunes that shows
us something of our ears that we
can't see, when we are just exer-
cising our muscles.
[img]cool.gif[/img]
<font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Um...this is so incredibly wrong it's hilarious.For instance, quantum physics is heady, and has philosophical and intellectual implications, but traditionally hasn't had a terrific number of practical applications.
wiki: quantum physics
wiki: quantum computing
I understood what Paraflam was saying. I just found his comment arrogant and a bit hostile if not outright troll-like.
I agree SpaceOtter. Drummers use layered polyrhythms all the time. Playing odd groupings over a Samba or Baion is a common example. Danny Carey's groove to Aenima is another. They're everywhere. It's up to the musician to find the appropriate situation to apply them. Without that ability, the musician has no choice. It's the easiest thing in the world to put down a hard earned skill.
Peace!
I don't see what the fuss is about. I think this guy is great and obviously trying to push some technical boundaries. But let's all instantly jump on the boat and accuse him of being unmusical, even though we don't have the faintest clue of what gigs he does outside of the woodshed.
Panos gigs a lot around town, and has for years. I've never seen or heard him myself, but just from seeing his name around a lot, I can only assume that he's either a very good musician, or a very good salesman. It's probably the former.
EDIT: Actually, I think I'm thinking of a different drumer: Tos Panos
My mistake.... [img]confused.gif[/img]
<font color="#a62a2a" size="1">[ January 19, 2006 04:47 PM: Message edited by: drumming sort of person ]</font>
<font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">EDIT: Scratch that, score one for BR. If what I said were true, we wouldn't be having a hostboard, and drum conversation, as scientists have been using QM to refine their understanding of computer components for a long time. My understanding of the field was missing some really important parts. Eesh.Originally posted by benrand:
[QB][Um...this is so incredibly wrong it's hilarious.
wiki: quantum physics
I was looking for an analogy of pure vs. applied. I wanted to reframe the argument of chops vs. feel/music in different terms so we didn't go around in circles again. Still, the originaly analogy may apply--it took a while for this new technical knowledge to be applied (or even believed) after it was discovered in the early part of the century, yes?
Perhaps the point is that Virg/Lang/Mangini/Vass./etc. are like that--coming up with new licks and skills, many of which are completely esoteric/useless, but a few of which some genius will apply soulfully to a situation and make work.
<font color="#a62a2a"><font size="1">[ January 19, 2006 05:27 PM: Message edited by: spaceotter ]</font></font>
<font color="#a62a2a" size="1">[ January 19, 2006 05:41 PM: Message edited by: spaceotter ]</font>
<font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">I think that sums it up. Even if he is strictly a soloist/exhibitionist, I think his drumming sounds good, and he demonstrates, what to me are, some very interesting and novel pedaling techniques.Originally posted by Rudy_Ment:
I don't see what the fuss is about. I think this guy is great and obviously trying to push some technical boundaries. But let's all instantly jump on the boat and accuse him of being unmusical, even though we don't have the faintest clue of what gigs he does outside of the woodshed.
<font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">I think that sums it up. Even if he is strictly a soloist/exhibitionist, I think his drumming sounds good, and he demonstrates, what to me are, some very interesting and novel pedaling techniques.Originally posted by Rudy_Ment:
I don't see what the fuss is about. I think this guy is great and obviously trying to push some technical boundaries. But let's all instantly jump on the boat and accuse him of being unmusical, even though we don't have the faintest clue of what gigs he does outside of the woodshed.
This endless debate about chops vs. musicality and how the two can be integrated reminds me of the pure vs. applied science thing. Pure scientists range out and ask questions about what's possible and stretch out theory in ways for which there are mostly no current applications. They ask questions merely to ask them, for curiosity, to explore what they can. Sometimes it seems like pure vanity. Then those tools & ideas & theories are available for when someone more "practically" minded wants to find a way to make them useful, or monetize them by applying them to a cell phone or something commercial.
For instance, quantum physics is heady, and has philosophical and intellectual implications, but traditionally hasn't had a terrific number of practical applications. However, the possibility of using this field for quantum computing--developing computers with amazingly small, fast, "yes, no, maybe" tri-setting processors--has come up as a way to continue making computers more powerful. (Somebody correct me if this is wrong; I'm no expert but this is what I have understood from recent reading.) Without the theory, the application wouldn't exist, and it takes application a long time to catch up to theory.
Similarly, some polyrhythms and raw chops exist for their own sake, and often have NO non-gratuitous application in music except to "show off" to other drummers. Then occasionally, a novel application appears for some of them. For instance, Jojo Mayer using his phenomenally over-developed chops to do those crazy drum&bass re-engineering licks with Nerve may be an example of why doing a single handed roll becomes desirable to actually make music. Now that he's shown the way to apply this technique, other people can do it. Without the technique, he probably would have given up before he succeeded though.
Both approaches are needed to advance the field--it's just that usually the explorers get scoffed at for vanity and irrelevance. Just some thoughts.
<font color="#a62a2a" size="1">[ January 19, 2006 12:38 PM: Message edited by: spaceotter ]</font>
I think it's cute he's trying to get that Weckl "bored" face going on while playing...
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