Christianity is going to get OWNED!

[ExtraPerson]

Originally posted by GretschyGreaser:
[QB] If you are going to go out and start rumors, bullshit , and have utter hatred for a group of people and then a person calls you on it don't bitch and act like you don't know what is wrong? QB]

<font size="2" face="verdana, arial">That really makes no sense as a question, that sentence started with 'if' and ended without making any sense at all.

Keep playing with colors because it is better than what you usually are playing with.

<font size="2" face="verdana, arial">You would know something like this because. . .?
Now who's the one making assumptions, not only that but petty childish remarks.

I'm not gonna respond to your posts anymore, you're even more confused than JWB. Besides, you are just trying to get attention.

[recoveringpunker]

Very interesting. I have to say I am pleased with most of the discusion here.

I would however like to point out somethings that stand out to me.

This thread was started with the basic intent to bash christianity, nothing more nothing less. Like always, bullshit fake ideas and misguided opinions about Mars seemed to be the "evidence" for such actions. No logical thought or real ideas were stated or brought up. There was no "proof" for the comment. This being the standard example of a person who doesn't like church, has some issues with God, angry with mankind, lashing out at any attempt to make their personal pain with the unknowing "afterlife" thought less active and persistent in their daily life.

I would like to know how life on Mars disproves the Bible.

I also read how Christianity has stated the Bible is "not Historicaly or Scientificly accurate", and is not intended to be so. I would like some proof of that. Both of Christianity saying so, and of the reasons why it is not historicaly or scientificaly correct. Please, no fighting out of opinions and personal ideaology, I want to know the proof in which you have to make such "factual" sounding statements.

I also read about Christians omission of Dinosaurs. Again, proof is where? Not looking for a argument over beliefs and personal feelings. Either the proof, or a re-statement with words such as "I believe", and "my opinion".

I am completely willing to hash out the history and science parts of this if you want. I will try to make plenty of time in my week to do this. If this is what comes of it.

Of course, we should start a new thread, Johnson and Greaser seems to be having a go at it over past issues that are being brought to the sevice over greasers apparent beliefs in Mormonism. (Which maybe we could go over later too.)

I have studied most religions, and science, and history. So I am taking which ever side "you" don't. I'm tired of people riffling off hate induced comments about religion, bashing religious folks for being mindless, and then having no real idea of what opinion they seem to hold.

[Jesus was BROWN]

I hate religion for the following reasons:
1)It is the cause of more conflict and wars than anything else, tolerance my ass.....
2)Organized religion = Organized theft, it's big business plain and simple.
3)Most religious people are EXTREMELY intolerant, Jesus wasn't intolerant, why should they be?
4)Whenever you debate religion, when a logical argument is made, the religious person argues faith. That is such bullshit, faith is the opposite of reason, it is this mystical magical thing that nobody can explain -REDICULOUS.
5)Religion is arrogant and elitist, religious people assume they are right and everyone else is wrong, who the fuck do they think they are?

My basic problem is that religion seems like it would be a good thing, but it never turns out that way. Throughout history it has caused more wars and problems than anything else, and always fought in the name of righteousness. When it comes to God, people just turn their brains off, and I can't stand it. Frankly, the world would be a better place without religion. I can only hope that one day people will start using there brains and see religion for the fraud it is.

Jesus(I'm an equal opportunity hater, I hate ALL RELIGIONS equally. Screw the Christians, Catholics, Mormons, Muslims, Seventh Day Adventists, Baptists, Lutherans, Presbyterians, Buddhists, Jews, Scientologists, and EVERY OTHER religion I forgot to list - YOU ALL SUCK!)

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<font color="#FFFF00" size="1">[ January 14, 2004 03:20 AM: Message edited by: Jesus was BROWN ]</font>

[mmsickboy]

"3)Most religious people are EXTREMELY intolerant, Jesus wasn't intolerant, why should they be?"

Well, I was raised Catholic, come from an Irish Catholic family and married a Mexican Catholic. It doesn't mean I agree with any or all of the policies of the Catholic Church. I go to Church, maybe a couple times a year, I go to confession probably once a year or so. My mom stopped making us go around the time I was 13 and told us if we wanted to continue in the faith, it was our choice and we wouldnt be thought any less for going or not. Now, I know of and accept evolution as pretty much fact. I know all of the things in the bible, particularly the Old Testament simply cannot have happened as described, but it is an interesting read as a history book. It was written by human beings, and nearly anything written by human beings is inherently flawed in some way, be it innacuracies or plain making things up. It may be different for the Jews as they existed thousands of years before Christ, but I'm not going to spout off about all organized religions.

The fact is that proofs for or against the existence of a supreme being are not required for me to go to mass, but faith has helped in part to get me through some hard times, and there is definitely a place for people to have a spiritual time for themselves, or a spiritual side, maybe organized religion is not the answer, (it hasn't been much of one throughout history, and born-again Christians usually make me think that for some, even one birth was too many), but alot of people have a need to think that they are not alone in the universe, that there is something out there larger than themselves that they can turn to for support and comfort even if it never answers back.

I just don't see the need for hate either way, but extremists in any form make it very hard for the moderates like myself, and I dislike any attempt to paint with borad sweeping strokes all practicers of any religion, or any sex, color, etc, it is simply ignorant.

The word tolerance for a lot people means something good, but it can also mean being polite just for the sake of it. When I see someone from PETA with their meat signs or those nice friendly, well illustrated pro-life banners outside of Planned Parenthood where some poor girl is just trying to get some birth control pills, it makes me sick. And I won't always keep my mouth shut just to tolerate someones ignorant stance on an issue.

I realize that you were making a broad accusation and lumping in "most" practicers of an organized religion, but don't lump me in. Thank you.

[GretschyGreaser]

I am not saying I believe in mormonism or if I care or not but if you start a thread where you start to openly hate a group then you are opened up to it.

So in a few months when the board is slow will they post the reasons to hate the jews thread??

[Jesus was BROWN]

Sorry Sinner, I don't want you to feel lumped in, but I believe that 99% of religious people are full of it. Notice I said MOST, not ALL. It's like lawyers, some of them are good, but 99% are like Johnny Cochran. If people actually acted like the Bible said to, the world would be better, but they don't. The problem with religion is MOST of the people that practice it are hypocritical dicks, and the fact that so much money is involved. Maybe when humanity evolves more it'll work, but as of now, I consider religion a miserable failure, not because of the religion itself, but because of the people "practicing" it.
That is all.

Jesus(Sinner = Part of the 1%)

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[esvenneby]

Once again, well put Sinner! When you go off on your tangents, I always like what you have to say.
JWB, I feel disapointed for the some of the same issues you do. In light of all, I try to love people more in spite of it, instead of hating and judging them. If they judge or hate, then that is in their heart to carry around.
Gretschy, good point. Who will get ragged on next!?
Recovering Punker- you should visit the board more often. I'm interested in what you have to say on this subject, as well as music (I can tell from previous posts that you have good taste). [img]wink.gif[/img]
As for me, I was baptized Catholic, and had no choice in the matter (which I think is ignorant). I went to Catholic church until I was 6, then a non-denominational, then a New Age church by 10. My mom has been to so many types of churches since. Science of Mind, New Age, Baptist, Lutheran, Unity, Bhuddism. I have joined her on occasion to different ones. I joined a girlfriend in a study group who was a Jehovahs Witness when I was 12. They all have something to teach you. The main thing is to have faith in God. I have adopted my own since of spirituality, and never considered myself any religion. Since a kid when I was asked my religion I would say spirituality. I dont think God looks down at us, and judges us like religions do. It's sad the horrible things people have done in his name. But, there is alot of wonderful things that people do for God's sake as well.
I went to church with the Mauers for a while. When I was going, it seemed like the Church's primary focus was to make people aware of the issues in the third world countries, and to do what we can to aid them. That is very cool. John played in the church band, which was very enjoyable. My son loved going to the Sunday school because he got to play with lil' Jack Maurer.
~ There's alot of freedom in "life and love" when your not wasting your energy judging one another. [img]graemlins/heart.gif[/img]

[swark]

well said.......I also would like to hear more from "recovering punker"

[recoveringpunker]

Awwww... you two give me warm fuzzies inside. Knock it off before I vomit on my keyboard.

My basic points are as followed (didn't that sound smart?!). hahaha

JWB goes off, and he seems to be and act like all the things he hates in religious folk.

People tend to use a persons religion against them. Why are you a dick? I thought you were a _____ (fill in blank).

Religion does not remove the human factor in people. We are still natural selfish assholes. Sometimes we experience moments a greatness, but realy we are all viewed as dillholes by someone. But, at least I know for a FACT that Churches do recognize their members who are still out right social retards, and do try to adjust their attitudes. NOw, some religions are based on the ever so childish "I'm right and your wrong" method, so most of a certain type are going to be bastards to all who think different.

I love when people say 99% of _____ are "this way". That is dumb. You do not know 50% of religious folk, yet generalize almost all. I am sure there is more blacks in the world, then there are in Compton. I should not judge all blacks as if they are thieving gang memebers that ruin their social enviroment. But some people (racist) do that very thing.

Just because corrupt cops make the news, does not mean there are not good cops. Channel 3 just doesn't air the nice guy who let you off with a warning about expired tags... or whatever. But, people still bring up Rodney King as the proof to hating police.

Simple philosophy for life: Assholes have to work too.

I have seen Pastors who have taken what the feel is a calling in life and turn it into a job. Simple reason, that is their source of income. If funds are down, natural fear sets in, and we become motivated to earn money. Pastors have to make car payments and put food on their tables. Now of course, we cannot view all Churches and pastors after what we see on TBN. Let us remember, that it is T.V. Not all families in Springfield are like the Simpons.

If you do not believe in God, then what do you believe in?

Any answer to that question, I can argue that you do not have proof, and are going by faith. Do not use someone elses faith against them. Because I will use yours against you.

I beleive in God. I do not believe in evolution. I am not realy any form of religion either. I actualy attended a Church in Long beach as of yesterday. I talked with the Pastor (who has been my friend for 12 years), and told him I didn't realy like the whole thing, and never realy did. I told him that Christianity fit my beliefs better then others, but that I was going to have to leave. We parted with respect for each other, and with the intent to remain friends.

You see, I explained MY THOUGHTS on the subject WITHOUT ripping his into pieces. That is how we are able to stay on good terms. I do not have to bash you to let you know I think differently.

Of course, sometimes I do all those things. Sometimes I enjoy fighting with people. Sometimes I argue just to argue, and it doesn't matter what side. I know who I am, and understand what qualities I possess. Good, bad and indifferent. I work on the bad (if I want), and try to excercise the good (when I feel like it). I know that I am generaly a good person but have one of the worst past ever in mankind history. I am an ex-herion addict. I have robbed more people then I know. I have served too much jail time. I have a understanding about myself today that doesn't allow me to bash others for their life choices. Because I am too easy of a target for them to return fire. Religious folk, non religious, and even anti-religious folk all lack a sense of humility. If everyone possessed that quality, then we'd all see a better society.


P.S. I believe the ownership of land is the reason for more wars and death in this world. Just because both sides believe in God or god, does not mean faith is the reason for war.

P.S.S. Buddhism is not a religion for future reference. It is a philosophy.


all this talk makes me have too poop. bye.

<font color="#FFFF00" size="1">[ January 14, 2004 05:07 PM: Message edited by: recoveringpunker ]</font>

[Jesus was BROWN]

I do agree with what you're saying, and I realize I am very much like an intolerant religious person, but I'm not hiding behind some righteous cause. I wish people would just be good to each other because it's the right thing to do, not because they're afraid of going to hell or of some punishment. I don't have an answer for why we're here, personally I think we're too limited as a species to know for sure at this point. I do believe in science, and I do believe in evolution. I realize it's very possible I'm wrong, but that also means I'm not so arrogant as to say I'm right and everyone else is wrong. Could there be a God? Of course their could be, but then again, do you think humans could possibly comprehend such a being? One of the major religions could be right, I have no idea, but I do know that doesn't entitle you to be an asshole. My point isn't that I hate the idea of religion, it's that I hate what it has become. It is a big money business where 99% of the people involved do not follow even the basic tenants of their religion. If people acted like Jesus, that'd be one thing, but we all know this isn't the way it is. Religion has gotten lost over the years, too much money and power is to blame. Perhaps someday it will come full circle, but I'm just not confident enough in people to believe it will be anytime soon. Again, I just want to make it clear that I don't hate religion because of what it is, I hate it for what it has become, and that's to blame on the people and money involved. That is all.

Jesus(Religion = Corrupt Corporation)

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