N1201-8A Cross-Over

[Tom Brennan]

Gary---If you search you'll find. One of the SuperSports posted on the subject, I just read it yesterday.

[gamalot]

Geez Tom, you are a PITA! LOL
I got the code but still can't find the info.
Think I need to buy a Vowel!

I know the 1209 was designed for Pro applications and although similar in style they are far different in performance.
I honestly believe all this stuff was designed around the rooms they were intended to be used in and it does make a big difference.
The 19 was a result that tried to match room accoustics to those who wanted great performance where rooms became the challenge.

Gary

[dgwojo]

Gary,
I poseted this last year regarding the caps and resistors, not sure about the coils, Dave.

Each N1209-8A has two 18mfd caps, one 6mfd, and one 10mfd, the resistors, two 2 ohm, and two 8 ohm. Each N1201-8A has one 8mfd, one 6mfd, one 21mfd, and one 16mfd cap, the resistors, one 3 ohm, two 3.9 ohm, and one 2 ohm.

[bigjunglejim]

Hi there... Being an electronic illiterate, I have no idea what this does for the 1209?

[gamalot]

"Being an electronic illiterate", ME TOO!

Basically I think it has to do with application.
1209 was a Pro design while the 1201/19 was more refined.

Don't take any of this to the bank but Altec made a road type 19 version for bands/PA use, possibly a 1234 model and it contained the 1209 XO. Quite possibly it also contained the 808 driver as opposed to the 802s.
I think I would consider the 1209 a bit more robust yet less refined in it's function.

[bigjunglejim]

I've never seen anything about a road version in Altec brochures. There was a (MDF) painted Model 19 if memory serves me right. It was painted grey and didn't have the vinal, textured pint or fiberglass finish and was intended for studio or permanent instalations.

Getting back to the crossovers. Can any of the our more knowledgable spell out the diffences between the 1201 and 1209 XO? I saw a post by Gary in another thread with the following;
Each N1209-8A has two 18mfd caps, one 6mfd, and one 10mfd, the resistors, two 2 ohm, and two 8 ohm.
Each N1201-8A has one 8mfd, one 6mfd, one 21mfd, and one 16mfd cap, the resistors, one 3 ohm, two 3.9 ohm, and one 2 ohm.
How would this effect the sound and it's powerhandling?

I'd like the building plans for the 1209 and the updated 1201 that DOESN'T use pots (L Pads?) in it's design.

One more question. How would the 416-V/421-8LF, 802 8ohm (Pascalite) combo do with the Model 19 1201 XO or the new updated 1201 (without pots)?

[bowtie427ss]

This is just a guess mind you, but i think Gary is onto something when he mentions the 808 driver.

From what i can gather, the 1209 was installed/shipped with SR systems exclusively containing symbiotic equipped drivers.

My feeling is that the 1209 is voiced/EQ'd for symbiotik drivers and the 1201 is voiced/EQ'd for the smoother responding aluminum/pascalite phrams in systems aimed more at hifi, critical listening/monitoring.

For now, this is my story and i'm stickin' to it!

[bowtie427ss]

I've never seen anything about a road version in Altec brochures. There was a (MDF) painted Model 19 if memory serves me right. It was painted grey and didn't have the vinal, textured pint or fiberglass finish and was intended for studio or permanent instalations.

<font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">1234 is bass reflex system with 421-8LF, 808-8B/511 and a 1.2khz 2nd order with a simple R/C eq/compensation circuit, it has a tolex covered box with casters, a very SR designed system.

9845A/9845-8A is a utility grey painted system with 416, 806/511, and N500 XO at 500hz........ still a long way off from a M19.


There is yet a 3rd XO that is quite similar to the 1201 and 1209 in topology, that's the 32343 found in Gary's 9849 monitors. they have the same component compliment of 4 caps, 4 resistors, and 3 inductors with a single L-pad and 1500hz XO point. These are without doubt EQ'd for the 802-8G driver.

The 9849's according to the 1975 reference materials were equipped with the "light" diaphrams.

It's my understanding that some M19's were equipped with "lights" and some were not, posing the following question in my mind.

Since the "light" phram is claimed to have a different (extended) response curve compared to the standard aluminum phram, were different component values in the M19 networks used and determined by which phrams were used from the factory?

Doesn't it stand to reason that different phrams would require different EQ/compensation?

Has anyone discovered two M19 networks that have at least some differing component values?

[Old Guy]

I doubt a change was made. The light diaphragms wee short lived, in more ways than one

Bear in mind the 19's HF is adjustable.

The only change may have been the "corner point" of the filter, which I doubt due to the above reasons.

[gamalot]

I should have been more clear about this "Road Version" "19 Type" speaker.
I don't know that Altec ever made a Utility 19.

At auctions, I have seen others refer to a speaker that has similar attributes and what appears to be a 416/811 load set. I think the number is 1234 but could be off on that and I also just think it is a 416/811 combo but could be off there as well. My memory as well as my interest in any speaker of this type was focused on the 1209 XO in them back when I was searching for 19 XOs.
I asked the difference way back and Dave Wojo chimed in with the info.

What we all have to keep in mind is that Altec's pro division would load many cabinets with just about any set you specifically stated. I would not be so fast to say a road cabinet never came with the 416-8B, 811B and 802-8Gs and possibly even the 1209 or 1201 XOs if the purchaser so stated.
There is plenty of info in the library here to show you could get anything you wanted at the PRO division.
It would not surprise me one bit to learn you could order a set of walnut or oak 19s with some changes such as 515 woofers instead of 416s. These were around when Altec had one thing in mind and that was to sell speakers any way they could! Also quite possible that Pro Sound dealers would make the switches themselves and sell the results as factory new speakers. We just don't know so I never doubt anyone who claims his 19s came "Factory" with something other then what we know to be a standard load set.
Sorry for rambeling ACRE but facts is facts and Altec was in business to sell speakers and from a few different divisions as well as from a number of different component and cabinet vendors.

Gary