Difference Between 806 and 802 Drivers

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January 18th, 2011, 01:55 PM
amandarae

Difference Between 806 and 802 Drivers

Hello guys,

I look up at the literature, compared the two and it is obvious that the 802 has a bigger magnet(higher SPL) and higher sensitivity. So I wonder why the 806, particularly the "A" sells much more than say 802D? Am I missing something?

Thanks,

Abe
January 18th, 2011, 02:19 PM
Old Guy

Re: Difference Between 806 and 802 Drivers

I'm used to the 802 selling higher.

Bear in mind a lot of buyers are not that savvy, and overpay. You may just be seeing instances of that. neither is a bad driver, just the 802 is better.
January 18th, 2011, 08:05 PM
amandarae

Re: Difference Between 806 and 802 Drivers

Thank you Old Guy!

I know it has to be something. I have an 806-A. I tried it with 500, 800, 1200 Hz X0 (with 416-8B in a 612C cabs) using 511 and 811 horns. I too prefer the 802D (8 ohms diaphragm installed) than the 806A with an 8 ohms diaphragm by a lot!!

Next, I will try to compare the two using a 414A/614 cabs(being built) at around 900 Hz. I think I already know the answer but hey, something to do to keep my mind away from buying more Altec stuff.

FWIW, I found the 802D(8 ohms diaphragm from GPA) on 811 horns with 416-8B/612C cabs using 1201-8A XO without the boost circuit (0.3 mH and Lpad) in front but with the Zobel compensation equalizer across the driver to sound much-much better than using the same components with the stock 1201-8A.

Thanks again!
January 19th, 2011, 04:51 AM
Ronald Lee

Re: Difference Between 806 and 802 Drivers

If I put a Symbiotik 'phram into a 802, then it becomes a 806?
January 19th, 2011, 08:55 AM
bowtie427ss

Re: Difference Between 806 and 802 Drivers

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ronald Lee

If I put a Symbiotik 'phram into a 802, then it becomes a 806?

It becomes an 808. If you put a symbiotik in an 806, you get an 807.

As for value/selling prices, green hammertone paint seems to be of more importance than the model number for a certain market segment where 802's and 806's are concerned.

EDIT: I should also add that for accuracy's(of driver ID) sake loading caps also come into play here.
January 19th, 2011, 01:12 PM
Old Guy

Re: Difference Between 806 and 802 Drivers

I should probably note th 806 was initially called an 804, then changed for some reason.

I suspect to avoid confusion with multicell numbers
January 20th, 2011, 09:06 AM
Earl K

Re: Difference Between 806 and 802 Drivers

Quote:

Originally Posted by O.G.

I should probably note the 806 was initially called an 804, then changed for some reason.

I suspect to avoid confusion with multicell numbers

Steve Schell addressed some of this very question in this thread over at LHF .

Quote:

Originally Posted by Steve Schell

Tom, I have it on good authority that the Altec 804A and 806A drivers are not identical. Although they look the same externally, the 804A has a considerably smaller alnico magnet than the 806A which was its successor. The 804A was introduced during a period when management was cheapening the Altec line into oblivion; the 605A replacing the 604D was another example of their insanity. Apparently the 804A's magnet was weak enough to move the mass corner downward and begin losing the top end, prompting the introduction of the 806A after many complaints to get the h.f. response back.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tom Brennan

Steve I'm forced to wonder about your source and his credibility. Jim Dickinson states the 804 was made from 1961 to 1964 and then rebranded as the 806 in 1964. Dickinson seems to know his Altecs.

Comparing 804 specs and 807 specs (1968 807 specs, and all seem to agree the 807 is an 806 with symbiotic) show the 804 and 807 having the same magnet weight, magnet strength and overall unit weight. This tends to confirm that the 804 and 806 are the same driver.

Perhaps your pal is confusing the 804-806 thing with the 802-806 thing.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Steve Schell

Tom, I checked with my friend Robert. He says that despite the published specs there are indeed several differences between the 804A and 806A examples he has had apart. He says the 804A magnet has a smaller outer diameter and the phasing plug has smaller slits, giving the driver a higher compression ratio than the 806A. He also said that the diaphragm in the 804A may have a shorter voice coil than the 806A, though he is not certain about this.

I remember taking apart a junky pair of 605A Duplex drivers years ago, and was surprised to find that the h.f. driver phasing plugs had smaller slits than the 806As and 802Ds I had at the time. Robert says that the 804A and 605A share this higher compression ratio phasing plug.

Robert is in the middle of moving, but if he can find these parts he will bring them to me to photograph. Stay tuned.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Steve S.

Robert brought me the magnets from Altec 802D, 806A and 804A drivers. As I hope can be seen in my crummy pictures, the 802D and 806A magnets have the same inner and outer diameters but are different heights as the 802D has a longer body. The 806A magnet has the same height and inner diameter as the 804A magnet, but the larger outer diameter that it shares in common with the 802D magnet. I don't know why these relationships aren't reflected in the Altec literature of the time, but suspect that the corporate cost cutting and subsequent eating crow may have played a part.

http://www.hostboard.com/forums/hbmc...2011/01/37.jpg
http://www.hostboard.com/forums/hbmc...2011/01/38.jpg

This seems pretty definative to my eyes .

Yet to be addressed ( with pics & measurements ) is Steves'/Roberts mention of the different phase plug found in the 804/605 duplex .

Also ( some conjecture ), the reworking of the 804 into the 806 may have triggered the development and introduction of the 23744 ( lite ) diaphragm ( to help restore the HF of the 806 back to the level of the previous generations, 802 ). Just a theory, mind-you ;)

<> EarlK
January 20th, 2011, 09:53 AM
bowtie427ss

Re: Difference Between 806 and 802 Drivers

I know the literature makes for fairly unreliable reference, but everything i've ever seen printed about the 804, 806, and 807 states the same 13oz/.8lbs magnet weight and 13,000 gauss flux density for all of those drivers.

Now, it's obvious that those mags shown are different. So, did Altec really print this much inaccurate data over such a span of time?
January 20th, 2011, 10:07 AM
Altec Best

Re: Difference Between 806 and 802 Drivers

Quote:

Originally Posted by Earl K

Steve Schell addressed some of this very question in this thread over at LHF .

http://www.hostboard.com/forums/hbmc...2011/01/37.jpg
http://www.hostboard.com/forums/hbmc...2011/01/38.jpg

This seems pretty definative to my eyes .

Yet to be addressed ( with pics & measurements ) is Steves'/Roberts mention of the different phase plug found in the 804/605 duplex .

Also ( some conjecture ), the reworking of the 804 into the 806 may have triggered the development and introduction of the 23744 ( lite ) diaphragm ( to help restore the HF of the 806 back to the level of the previous generations, 802 ). Just a theory, mind-you ;)

<> EarlK

Hey Earl, Actually the 23744 was developed for the 604-8G mid '70's and then found it's way into the all new 802-8G and then finally the later version of the 806-8A,B's IIRC.Then that was replaced with the 34647 with the new 902's again if recollection serves me correctly.
January 20th, 2011, 12:10 PM
Old Guy

Re: Difference Between 806 and 802 Drivers

`

I'm willing to be of open mind on all this. By the time I was associated with Altec the 804 was long dead.

Gonna pooh-pooh the conjecture about the light fram though, there is a missing decade there.

Edit: I don't have any specs for an 804...only 804A, physical weight given for it is same as 602.

Leads me to wonder...are 804 and 804A different?

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