wanna learn LATIN...

hello guys...

I was asked to play a kinda latin song
from Jaci Velasquez, I don't know
if you heard "un lugar"!...
but I'm having a difficult
time feeling (and playing) it [img]graemlins/cry.gif[/img]
I'm not really that good (schooled)
and versatile of
a drummer like you guys here...

any chance you could tell me how I could
get this... what should I learn first and
are there sites that I could get info from...

you may ask "why not get an instructor?"...
maybe next year I'll get some jazz and
latin lessons... but now I need a quick
crash course?! [img]redface.gif[/img] if there is such a thing [img]eek.gif[/img]

Learn the permutations of the clave, then apply it on the kit with the cascara then learn a simple songo beat and then you should be able to make it through.

Chuck Silverman is the man.

Chuck's site

Are you talking about "Un Lugar Celestial" off of the album "Llegar A Ti" ?

I heard a little snippet on Amazon-it has a Spanish feel to it- but I'm not sure how to classify it- I don't think it's Afro-Cuban. (Kind of an "In Your Eyes" kind of feel. Anyone?)

You just need to play along to this sucker about a hundred times. It's challenging because it's slow, there's a lot of space, and it's not "Boom Dat! Boom Boom DAT! I would advise anyone trying to learn 'Latin' to listen and play-along. It's the only way. It's not a pattern out of a book. Neither is jazz...

Cheers

just fake it til you make it! [img]wink.gif[/img]

I listened to a snippett of it on Amazon also.

Listening to Yellow Jackets stuff helped me alot with these types of patterns where the groove is applied over a "buh bump", "buh bamp", "buh bump", "buh bump" over the bass drum.

You'll need to play this 4 E & ("A" "1") B.D. pattern until you want to puke. Because everything is built around it. Place a 1/4 note on the HH and just add sparcings of the snare here and there.

You basically play either a modified 4/4 groove over the B.D. pattern, or applying polyrythms (especially w/the snare) over the B.D. pattern.

Check out a BossaNova drumset pattern. Thats a good beggining excercise in developing this type of polyrhythmic feel. Also.... if you have it available to you, check out Greg bissonets video. Greg is the one that taught me my latin grooves and he has a really great way of breaking it down down so you can start playing some form of latin almost right away.

Hope this helps

-j

Oh!!!

And the Alex Acuna video is the shiz-nitz for this stuff. Covers EVERY latin groove you'd every want to play.

-j

That song, it is just like a samba... it basically is a samba during the verse, during the chorus, just a 4/4 groove. If i can remember correctly, for the chorus, just play bass drum on the 16th note before the 1 and the 3, and then play the 1 and the 3 also. Play the 16th note before the 2 and the 4 on the bass drum, for the 2 and 4, snare drum. 8ths on the ride cymbal.
For developing independence for the samba verse part, play the samba bass drum pattern (bass drum on all quarters, and the 16th note preceeding the 1, 2, 3, 4). Over that, just play the first three pages of stick control. It will break up your limbs quite nice.
Un Lugar is a great song... it has been a long time since i have played it. The snare drum knocking part during the verse, rememeber to keep it laid back... it doesn't push at all, very back in the pocket.
Good Luck! [img]wink.gif[/img]

Can someone upload a copy of it? That would help. What I heard(grainy Amazon clip) didn't sound like a Samba to me...

A bossa, i should say.

Quasi-bossa... i don't remember it being anything else.

With regard to Latin, there are a few major points to consider and you'll sail through it better. First, do not confuse Cuban and South American music. Cuban music is, for the most part, in clave. South American music, for the most part, is not, despite what well meaning people say about a "clave" in bossa nova. No, that's not clave. A clave goes far beyond a repetitive pattern to a figure that actually organizes musical arrangements. Second, Cuban music (and I generalize) avoids the "one", in favor of the "and" of "two" and the "four", especially when playing bass drum. Conversely, South American music (and I realize that I'm generalizing because I play with two writers, one from Argentina, one from Cuba and have to differentiate), emphasizes a more even four feel. That spoken, in a lot of South American music, particularly samba and bossa, you can make your grooves more emphatic by leaning on the "two" of each measure when counting in cut time.

There are so many teachers who will teach samba and bossa and some sort of "mambo" in the same breath. Then they impose some kind of stickings on top and claim that it's "Latin fusion".

I recommend highly that you search out anything with Joey Heredia on it. He's hip, funky, and respectful of the traditions....but he never "crosses the clave".
WB

Woah... thanks guys for the BIG HELP!!! Lots of GREAT INFOs [img]smile.gif[/img]

I'll read your posts (more carefully) later (I just logged in for a quick peek) after I finished helping out, cooking some spaghetti for the Kid's "post" Christmas Party in our Church... well I think I have plenty of time to get some research and practice coz I'll be playing that on the 2nd of January...

see you guys later... God Bless!! [img]graemlins/thumbs_up.gif[/img]

<font color="#a62a2a" size="1">[ December 29, 2004 11:40 PM: Message edited by: tradfreak ]</font>

Gary Chaffee was the one who pointed out to me that most Brazilian music had a sort of "Samba clave".

It's basically the Partido Alto rhythm: 2 on, 3 off, then 2 on again(the beat).

He just meant clave in the "underlying rhythm", or "key" sense...

This was just as helpful to me as learning about Clave in Afro-Cuban music.

Quote:

---

Originally posted by tradfreak:
hello guys...

I was asked to play a kinda latin song
from Jaci Velasquez, I don't know
if you heard "un lugar"!...
but I'm having a difficult
time feeling (and playing) it [img]graemlins/cry.gif[/img]
I'm not really that good (schooled)
and versatile of
a drummer like you guys here...

any chance you could tell me how I could
get this... what should I learn first and
are there sites that I could get info from...

you may ask "why not get an instructor?"...
maybe next year I'll get some jazz and
latin lessons... but now I need a quick
crash course?! [img]redface.gif[/img] if there is such a thing [img]eek.gif[/img]

---

<font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Can you play all the major Ryth patterns from the styles of Latin/Afro music.. e.g Mozambique, Bosanova, Salsa, Rumba, Mambo, Samba, Mirengue etc.?

Each of these unique styles of latin music has its own unique Clave Pattern inside itself. It is good thing to identify that pattern, because if you're playing against that, there's is no way the groove is gonna sound settled. It's more gonna sound like a rythmic struggle between you and nature of the style the others are playing. You can feel it instant with the bass-player. This can go the other way around too.

I'm not a latino monster, but that was how my teacher taught me how to understand the basics of latin rythms and playing them in band-situations.

I hope it helps, listen to as much latin as possible, focus on how the bass, piano, drums and percussion are locked in with each other. Try to create a overview of the rythms and try to figure out the Clave rythm that melts all these rythms into the tune.

another thing is... the drummer of the
"un lugar celestial" tune sounds familiar...

hmmmnnn [img]graemlins/wonder.gif[/img]

I smell... or I hear... VINNIE?! [img]eek.gif[/img]

I'll be checkin out everything you
guys posted... compared to this tune,
"mourning into dancing" of Ron Kenoly
is much easier to "fake".. LOL!

ei matricks, it's nice to know you
played that tune before... when, where
and what event? just wondering...

thanks again for the help guys...
HAPPY GIG FILLED NEW YEAR TO ALL!!! [img]graemlins/thumbs_up.gif[/img]

I found that Ignacio Berroa's videos on learning latin drumming are some of the best and well-explained on the market.

Ignacio takes his time to show the basics and then moves to more complex excercises. Check it out.

Ignacio is the man.

Also, if you learn the diff between regular son clav ein it's permutations and rhumba clave, you'll be ok. I think Garibaldi goes through it on the talking drums vids (which are REALLY good) if you need explanation.

Rhumba clave rocks.