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Who is the best athlete to have played in swva in the past 15 years. This can include anything done in Little League, the playground, high school, college, professional, etc. They should also be from swva, not someone who played ball at Clinch Valley or others and is from Richmond. I will mention mine after a few people post. If you can't narrow it down to one list a couple of people.
As an all around athlete my vote would probably go to Justin Hamilton. If you go with individual sports I would say:
Football: Thomas Jones
Basketball: Brad Knuckles
Baseball: Billy Wagner
Track: Grady Kring
Football- Heath Miller\Julius Jones
Basketball - Calvin Talford (may have been 16 or 17 years ago)
Baseball- Billy Wagner
Track - Is that a real sport?
I think its hard to go with Julius over Thomas at this point...if you break it down Thomas had the better career of the two in H.S. even though Julius was great in his own right. Thomas also had the better career in College. Its too early to tell as far as NFL goes because both are still playing...even though I would say Julius is the more talented of the two he still has not produced at the same level that Thomas has(yet). As far as Heath Miller goes he had a great H.S. career but not on the level of either of the Jones boys. He had a great college career as well finding his true position. He had a really nice rookie year just to be able to start but the jury is still out on how good of a TE he will become in the NFL. Based on what they've done so far I would say its 1. Thomas 2. Julius 3. Miller...all have been pretty impressive.
<font color="#a62a2a" size="1">[ May 17, 2006 05:56 PM: Message edited by: biggamesjames ]</font>
grady kring in track...are you serious? mike owens was a better track athlete than grady kring.
track is certainly calvin talford
I would agree its Talford but he said last 15 years...Don't think Talford's ran any track in the last 15 years do you?
Well I would figure you would atleast have to win a state championship in something to be considered the best in that sport. I wanted to put Mike in there cause he's my boy and I need a loan but as awesome as Mike was in track I wasn't able to find his name in the state champion column where as Grady Kring's and several other swva names were there. I will admit that I don't know alot about the sport and kinda have to agree with orange tiger's assessment about track but I did go back again and look it up and there were a few from swva who had more impressive #'s than Kring. I just threw his name out there because he was the 1st to come to mind. The candidates who one of which would have to rank #1 in the last 15 years would be between:
Julius Jones, 4 time state champion in 3 different events.
Major Griffey, 3 time state champion in 2 different events.
Sam Daniels, 2 time state champion in 2 different events.
Joel Davis, 2 time state champion in 2 different events.
Justin Hamilton, 2 time state champion in 2 different events.
I can't believe I'm talking this much about track [img]smile.gif[/img]
<font color="#a62a2a" size="1">[ May 18, 2006 11:08 AM: Message edited by: biggamesjames ]</font>
I would pick Thomas Jones. I read an article about the Jones boys in recent ESPN magazine. That got me thinking about the post topic. Funny thing about that article. They referred to PV as Big Stone Gap High School. I only say TJ play once in high school. PV was playing Richlands. The media was hyping the game as Jones vs a linebacker from Richlands(I can't remember his name). You can guess who won that battle. I don't remember how many yards he had but Jones made them look like a LL team.
Talford was a little before '90 I think. I'll never forget him in the NCAA dunking contest. Dickie V and Jimmy Valvano were flipping out.
Did Billy Wagner play anything other than baseball?
<font color="#a62a2a" size="1">[ May 18, 2006 10:39 PM: Message edited by: Dunduin ]</font>
I thought the topic was players you've actually played against. With that in mind i'll list em.
Football: Heath Miller. Ryan Wallace intercepted two of his passes and then Heath Miller broke his rib pads. Heath Miller was a badass.
Basketball: I didn't play but from what i've seen i'd give the best to knuckles
Baseball: Again didn't play but from what i've seen. Jordan Compton or Heath Miller
Track: This is tough. Tyler Powers might just take region this year in four events but Zack just broke Mike's 200 record and I think tied the 100 but i'm not sure there. Then again Rob Colley won a state championship in the 800 and Ryan Wallace or Jake Colley could beat teams on their own with the points they made at track meets.
So pick one and i'd agree
Track: Tyler/Zack/Rob/Wallace/Jake
As far as track being a real sport it is much more of a sport than baseball.
That LB's name was probably Jeremy McCommins from Richlands.
Yeah TJ had arguably the greatest H.S. career of any football player in swva history. Don't really remember him doing much in any other sport though. I saw him play basketball and he was less than impressive...don't think he played baseball?...he was pretty good in track ofcourse but his little bro was quite a bit better.
<font color="#a62a2a" size="1">[ May 18, 2006 12:06 PM: Message edited by: biggamesjames ]</font>
This $#@%%* computer has shut down about five times when typing this. The short reply is I picked Jones over all others because no one stood out enough in any other sport
Football...nobody was close
Basketball...Knuckles didn't compare
Baseball...the level of competition wasn't good enough to know
Track...should have but admittedly didn't think enough about it
BGJ, that was the Richlands linebackers name.
Gotta post in short bursts. Dunduin, why is track more of a sport than baseball? Have you ever hit a 90 mph baseball?
Baseball is the only sport you can fall asleep and still play.
Seriously. Go ahead and tell me why track is more of a sport.
Track is a competition between athletes in a mostly individual setting. I guess that is why I don't look at it as a sport. I'm not knocking the athletes...because they are athletes. Baseball is a true sport. It has individual and team concepts, but its is mostly a team game. It can become very boring to WATCH, but if you ever fall asleep while playing I hope you dont get drilled with a line drive. It is a scientific fact that the most difficult thing in all of sports is to hit a round object with another round object ( bat and baseball) especially when one of them is traveling 90 mph.
Let's be honest guys, the reason people could think both these sports are less than athletic is because of the level of BDD talent in both lately. IMO any activity that requires conditioning any part of your body to be good at could be a sport. (Anything good coming to mind)
The biggest reasons baseball is so boring in the BDD is the enrollment factor and the success factor. Hard to field a good 9 man team when you have little to choose from and the teams don't really do anything outside the district anyway. Don't be exaggerating on hitting that 90 mph heat. There hasn't been one of those in the BDD for over 25 years. Jordan Compton was mid-80's at best and the games I saw he wasn't that. The only legit one I can even think of was Kenny Bostic who played in I think the late 70's. Had some pro tryouts but was ultimately too short.
As far as track, James had it right. The biggest reason to go was to check out the shorty shorts on the girls.
I don't thnk you can use enrollment as a reason. BDD football wouldn't be called boring and it obviously takes more people to field a competitive football team.
BDD baseball just is not focused on and isn't taught well. The only team I saw in the 90's with a strong fundamental base was Honaker. Whitewood had good program for a few years because they just happened to have several good baseball players in the school at one time. It was pretty odd that that occurred considering the enrollment grades 7-12 was about 15 people.
Honaker baseball has always been competitive no matter what district they were in. I played from 1984-1987 and we lost 8 games in 3 years and went to the regionals each year. Last year was the first losing season for Coach Harding since 1972. he is the reason baseball is fundamentally strong year in and year out. They are a little over 500 this year with a team of mostly freshmen and sophmores. The man is a baseball genius around here and he would appreciate your kind words as do I. They finished 2nd to Haysi in the district this year. I think they have as good a team except for pitching. The Jones kid from Haysi is very good and seems to be a class act also. He will play baseball in college if he wants.
It does take more people to have competitive football, but it takes a more specialized person to play baseball well. Like one of you said about the difficulty of hitting a 3 inch sphere with a 3 inch round bat that you have to hit on about a 1 inch vertical sweet spot. Both sports have their tougher positions, but personally I think it is easier to teach a 250-300 lb guy to block someone than it is to teach a kid to pitch, catch, judge a fly ball and to actually hit a ball with purpose rather than stick the bat out a pray.
As for Honaker baseball, I don't like Harding so I won't rant on him as it would probably be biased. But I will say, having played in the Honaker LL system on a team from Council, I think that is where their success comes from. They bring all their feeder schools together and rather than keeping them separated, they combine them on their 6-8 various teams and have some good volunteer coaches (except ole Johnny Peck). I will say(although it's tough) that Harding is good at his job also.
<font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">There is no doubt that baseball is the toughest "skill" sport to play. It doesn't require the most conditioning or the biggest strongest player, but it does require skill at every position.Quote:
Originally posted by hipocrit:
It does take more people to have competitive football, but it takes a more specialized person to play baseball well. Like one of you said about the difficulty of hitting a 3 inch sphere with a 3 inch round bat that you have to hit on about a 1 inch vertical sweet spot. Both sports have their tougher positions, but personally I think it is easier to teach a 250-300 lb guy to block someone than it is to teach a kid to pitch, catch, judge a fly ball and to actually hit a ball with purpose rather than stick the bat out a pray.
As for Honaker baseball, I don't like Harding so I won't rant on him as it would probably be biased. But I will say, having played in the Honaker LL system on a team from Council, I think that is where their success comes from. They bring all their feeder schools together and rather than keeping them separated, they combine them on their 6-8 various teams and have some good volunteer coaches (except ole Johnny Peck). I will say(although it's tough) that Harding is good at his job also.
As for Coach Harding at Honaker, you won't find a better coach or man around. He along with Mack Shupe are the best maybe in the state. Harding has over 400 career wins and only a couple of losing seasons. I'm not sure what your grip with Harding is but he has a ton of respect for his players as well as opponents.
You are right about the Honaker little league program and their volounteer coached. Having been one myself, over 1\2 of the coaches in the system have usually played high school baseball for Coach Harding. They then pass along what they remember to the younger kids, so he has a hand in the Little League system also.
It's not easy to teach a guy to block someone. There's more to blocking than just throwing yourself at a guy. Balance and footwork are key. I was only around 200 pounds and I played OL and DL and most of the bigger guys we played were no where near the level our line was although we were much smaller (Me, Mo, Nick, Wade, being around 200 and under with only blake and josh yates (and greg barton when josh was hurt) being the only people 250+).
And yeah hitting a baseball takes skill not athletics. Baseball lies in the same category as an archery contest.
<font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Your analogy of baseball and archery is dumbfounded. Baseball players are some of the best athletes in the world. At some schools on the HS level, some kids may be able to get by with no athletic ability, but the same can be said for football. I think the biggest knock on baseball comes from football players who don't play baseball. Football players often rant about how baseball is a P**** sport b/c there is no contact. Well having played both baseball and football, let me tell you which is scarier. Lining up across from a 300 pound all state D-end or taking an 80mph fastball to your head, back, hand, etc....there is no comparison. Getting hit with a round, hard object traveling at speeds faster that the legal driving speed limits, often fast enough to break bones is scary. Not only do you have to be a skilled athlete to play baseball but you have to have BALLS!!Quote:
Originally posted by Dunduin:
It's not easy to teach a guy to block someone. There's more to blocking than just throwing yourself at a guy. Balance and footwork are key. I was only around 200 pounds and I played OL and DL and most of the bigger guys we played were no where near the level our line was although we were much smaller (Me, Mo, Nick, Wade, being around 200 and under with only blake and josh yates (and greg barton when josh was hurt) being the only people 250+).
And yeah hitting a baseball takes skill not athletics. Baseball lies in the same category as an archery contest.
Very well said. I played both sports also. Each takes different type of skills.Baseball is the one that takes the most. In football you always have a group of kids who are "on the team" and shall we say not so athletic, baseball on the other hand must consist of even the benchwarmers being able to contribute to the team.
The scariest moments I've ever had while playing any sport was being undercut while airborne trying to land after a dunk. I've been hit by pitches before and I've been hit by numerous 300 pound lineman...neither scared me all that much because I was wearing a helmet in both situations. Football is overrall alot more dangerous than baseball however just because there is contact on every single play from every possible angle on every possible part of your body and you often don't see it coming. There is some contact in baseball but it usually only happens once or twice per game on a wild pitch or a play at home plate. In football it is every possession, every single play, every single minute. Make no mistake baseball and basketball are "contact" sports...football is a "collision" sport.
Not really sure where you are coming from on that orange tiger. Pretty much every sport has players who never see any P.T. Football is the ultimate team sport over all others because all guys "who are on the field" have to do their job and have to contribute. If you have 10 guys on a given play do exactly what they are supposed to and one guy misses a block then the whole play could be screwed. On the next play 10 guys do a perfect job and the pass is perfect but the receiver drops it or the receiver is wide open but the QB makes a bad throw...etc it goes on and on. Same for defense 10 guys do their assignment perfectly but one guy bites on a pump fake and blows his coverage...result: Touchdown. In basketball we have all seen one or two guys take over a game...In baseball I have been to games where the pitcher just shut down the other team and nobody even had to field a grounder. It just doesn't work that way in football...no one guy can take over a game and win it...just not going to happen. Sure all are team sports and require some guys to step up but in football it takes all 11 pretty much all the time.
It's about time people started talking on here. It's hard to talk about the BDD to people when you live in Georgia.
I guess your right James. All of these sports have to be team sports, but made up of individual accomplishments that contribute to the same goal.Most teams , wheather it be football, basketball, or baseball have there 1 or 2 go to guys that are considered a star. Any kid who goes out for a team and practices every day and toughs out a season deserves to be considered part of the success of the given team. I didnt mean to belittle any player on any team.
As far as me personally I was knocked out on kickoff return and hit in the ankle with a 90 mph fastball (Kirk Goodson from Independance) and I'll take the K.O. anytime.
Yeah I would say it would be hard to find a guy that wants to get hit by a wild pitch...have to be crazy. I doubt Dale Jr. goes down to Talladega hoping to hit the wall at 200mph either but it doesn't necessarily make nascar a more physical sport than football. Getting hit by a pitch just doesn't happen all that much as opposed to football you are guaranteed to get hit pretty much every play. Just a huge difference in the physicality of these two sports...huge. I went through one entire season in little league batting 3rd in the line-up and only got hit once and thats with quite a few wild pitchers in our league.
I wasn't saying that it was easy to teach someone to block "well". Not all big men on the line are co-ordinated, that is something very hard to teach. You have to be co-ordinated in baseball to hit for a good average. Each sport has positions that require God-given talent to excell.
I've played both sports as well and in my opinion baseball is the harder one to teach the lesser players how to be good. Baseball and archery, thats a good one.
I NEVER THOUGHT I'D SAY THIS,BUT I AGREE WITH 'JAMES ASSESSMENT.BACK IN THE DAY,I PLAYED ALL THREE AND A VALID ARGUMENT CAN BE MADE FOR EACH.LET'S AGREE TO DISAGREE AND SAY THAT IT TAKES SPECIFIC TALENTS FOR EACH AND THAT A LEAST A LITTLE TALENT IS REQUIRED.JAMES IS RIGHT THOUGH,IN FOOTBALL YOU'RE GETTING POUNDED ON A REGULAR BASIS,ONE PERSON BREAKS DOWN AND THAT CAN MAKE OR BREAK THE PLAY AND/OR GAME.BASKETBALL CAN BE JUST AS PHYSICAL,AND GETTING "CUT" IS NO FUN,NO CONTROL OF YOUR BODY OR HOW YOU MAY LAND,TRUST ME,I BELIEVE I'D RATHER GET BLINDSIDED THAN CUT(AT LEAST IN FOOTBALL I HAD PADS ON,MY ONLY CONCERN WAS BREAKING MY NECK,IN BASKETBALL IT WAS BREAKING MY LEG,FORTUNATELY NEITHER HAPPENED).AND GRANTED,A GREAT AMOUNT OF SKILL IS REQUIRED TO HIT "THE HEAT",BUT AS PREVIOUSLY STATED,IT'S THE ONLY SPORT WHERE ONE PLAYER CAN LITERALLY MONOPOLIZE A GAME AND SHUT DOWN THE OPPOSITION.IT APPEARS THE ONLY UNIVERSAL HERE WOULD BE SPEED,YOU CAN BUILD FROM THERE.WHAT'S YOUR TAKE JAMES(BY THE WAY CAN SOMEBODY POST A HAYSI AND HONAKER FOOTBAL SCHEDULE OR A BDD MASTER SCHEDULE FOR FOOTBAL FALL '06)?
Yeah I would say speed, quickness and strength are universal with about any sport.
I think Haysi's schedule will look something like this:
Clintwood Home
Rye Cove Away
Honaker Away
Twin Valley Away
Betsy Layne Away
Lee High Away
Hurley Home
Letcher Central Home
Ervinton Home
Grundy Home
GEEZ,WHY SUCH A SCHEDULE.SEVERAL AWAY(CONSECUTIVE) AND THEN SEVERAL HOME,SURELY COLLEY DIDN'T MAKE THE SCHEDULE OUT THAT WAY.I KNOW THE E-TOWN GAME IS A COUNTY THING,BUT PROBABLY BE BETTER TO FIND,I DON'T KNOW,MAYBE LEBANON.I SEEM TO THINK YOU MENTIONED THAT BEFORE,BUT THAT WOULD BE A GOOD ONE TO GET ON THE SCHEDULE.ANY POSSIBILITIES OF THAT MATERIALIZING ANY TIME IN THE NEAR FUTURE?
If I had my way I would drop Betsy Layne and RC and try to pick up Lebanon and maybe somebody like Tazewell or Graham. I don't like the Ervinton game but its one of those deals where you just about have to play them. I don't think Ervinton would like losing a 2nd big gate in as many years either since Clintwood already dropped them last year.
How is it not billy wagner in baseball. I mean jordan was good and miller was pretty good but wagner is one of the best closers in the majors right now. How is he not the best from our little area then.
Good lord our schedule sucks. There are two good teams on it at all.