G1s on the top, resonant on the bottom is happiness for me. Maybe just one strip of tape if a tom is being cranky.
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G1s on the top, resonant on the bottom is happiness for me. Maybe just one strip of tape if a tom is being cranky.
Most engineers are retarded and are too lazy to work on mic placement etc. I would just keep the ambassadors on them. No matter what you use, it sounds like the engineers your working with will act the same way.
Another reason why you should record and engineer yourself if possible.
I couldn't agree with DSOP more. it's laziness.. Unless the session is calling for a very specific sound, stay with what you like. That is a very "open" combo your using. Moon Gel is ok. I also use the new Evans MinEMAD's. they work great. I refuse to let some engineer put tape on my heads. Keep your drums tuned up right and you won't have many problems.
I would say definitely stick w/ ambassadors. To me, they're the ultimate for studio. Unfortunately, they lose thier luster relatively quickly. I've been using Emperors for live situations because I'm too broke to change heads every week! Also heard good things about these new tom heads from Evans designed in conjunction w/ Bob Gatzen. Anybody checked them out yet?
http://www.evansdrumheads.com/EVANew...px?CodaID=5879
try the Aquarian Jack DeJohnette heads, single ply......more controlled for studio then Ambassador.
I strongly prefer 1-ply heads in the studio. I use coated Aquarians top and bottom on my toms, although I usually use the far more durable Hi-Energy head on my snares. Prior to signing with Aquarian, I used coated Ambassadors top and bottom, another excellent sounding combination.
In the studio, how good you sound is often a component of how good the engineer is. If moongels and duct tape are what it takes for him or her to get you sounding good, go with the flow. Flexibility is key in the studio. But I've never had a problem with coated 1-ply heads - if they need a little duct tape, it's no biggie to me.
One habit I got into when I was playing a lot of high volume bar gigs was to keep one set of batter heads JUST for recording. I'd gig all the time with heads on my toms that were chosen mostly for their volume and durability: Aquarian Classic Clear with Power Dot heads. Then whenever I got a session, I'd pull out my 1-ply coated heads, put them on the toms, and do the session. Then I'd swap back to the dot heads for my live gigs.
I got one set of 10, 12, and 14" coated batter heads to last me through MANY sessions that way, because the only time they got played was in the studio. The rest of the time, I'd be beating the hell out of those dot heads (which are okay in the studio, but I much prefer the coated ones, even though they're less durable).
This was far less expensive than putting brand new heads on the drums for every session, but gave me fresher heads than if I'd just used the ones that got beat up nightly on live gigs.
Mr. A.
Thanks guys, I really appreciate it. Wnat heads are you using on the kick?
I have been doing some recordings lately with Ambassador heads on top and bottom of both toms and snare. Most engineers don't complain but alot of the will use moon-gel generously. Other drummers have suggested that I use emperer (I know I am spelliing it wrong) heads for the studio but I kind of like my toms open. Any head suggestions?
Some engineers and producers don't understand that each component in a drum set is part of a 'set' and needs to be treated as such. But then again, listen to the radio these days, and you won't hear any drums that sound like real drums. I guess that's why I don't listen to radio or pop music anymore....
Sorry for the double post but, don't you hate doing a live gig and the engineer tells you to de-tune your toms because (I swear I have heard this) the toms are too "resonant"........ What???????
Sometimes the engineer is right. He's hearing the drums through the monitors in another room with a mike a couple inches off the head isolated - so every little issue becomes more obvious. Certain yowl's, groans or rings that might not sound that bad behind the kit, can create a nightmare for the engineer during mixdown. It's better to fix as many as possible problems before tracking. If you know the engineer has gotten great drum sounds consistently in the past - I'd trust him. If his drum sound is mediocre - I wouldn't.
That said, I've gotten good results with both Ambassadors and Emperors before. I played a soundtrack where they insisted I use the studio drums (Tribes drums) - but the 2-ply heads were totally shot. Big dents all over. I tuned them as good as I could, and they actually sounded great afterwards. So you never know.
<font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Drum Counselor and I played 'em in the Evans drum booth at Summer NAMM. Good sound! They are like G2's with a poly piece glued to the bottom of the head that controls some of the high end ring.Quote:
Originally posted by Drumdoc69:
Also heard good things about these new tom heads from Evans designed in conjunction w/ Bob Gatzen. Anybody checked them out yet?
http://www.evansdrumheads.com/EVANew...px?CodaID=5879
The next time I record, I'm going to try using a double ply head on the bottoms of my 14" and larger toms. It gives you a bit more bottom end and controlled tone. I did it on my 12x14" floor and it sounds great!
Mike
DSOP you're taking the Jazz mentality to recording. In that situation, I agree - but you still need to deal with tuning/ring problems as early as possible.
<font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Yes, and no....Quote:
Originally posted by Vdrummer:
DSOP you're taking the Jazz mentality to recording.
I just like drums to sound like drums. Whether it's jazz (which I don't do much of at all) or rock. When I first started playing, many moons ago, my favourite players were Keith Moon and Ginger Baker. Their drum sound was very organic and I still find myself yearning for that sound. More recently, I love how Simon Phillips, Dave Weckl and Steve Smith record their drums. It's no surprise that each of those guys is very 'hands on' when it comes to recording....
<font color="#a62a2a" size="1">[ August 30, 2005 04:14 PM: Message edited by: drumming sort of person ]</font>
I like that too sometimes. Jet has that kind of sound, as does the new Audioslave record.
I guess thatr is the trick then. Keeping my open/earthy sound while stile being studio friendly........
What style of music are you recording?
If they're tuned nice, dampening them 'a little' shouldn't kill and actually might improve the sound...are you good at drum tuning?
Funky jazz and r&b. But lately I find myse;f doing everything but bluegrass.....
"Stran'gee. It stank so good"
Tuning is first and foremost. Make sure you have no wavering or predominant overtones. If you tune top and bottom to the same "pitch" they need to be spot on with each other or you'll get that pitch flutter that makes engineers crazy (thus "can you dampen those a bit, please?"). If you tune the bottom higher than the top be sure they are at least a whole step or better or you will once again get that wavering that is caused when two tones are somewhere within a half step of each other.
If engineers and drummers alike understood more of the physics of drum tuning we wouldn't argue so much about this issue. I have done a lot of shows this summer with quite a few good sound companies that were able to get a great sound from my VERY open Gretsch kit with minimal and, in some cases, no sound check. There was only one instance where I had to resort to pulling out my mixer to do it myself and that was because there weren't enough channels open on the house to accomodate what I needed. Each of these engineers knew how to place mic's and set e.q. right from the start because they knew how to respond to a wide open kit (I've worked with most of these guys in the past so we knew what to expect from each other).
It all begins with a drum that has a good, round, steady tone. The drums also must resonate together as a choir as well. If you have weird sympathetic vibrations happening that will also cause engineers to toss you a roll of gaffer's tape. This all becomes more important in the studio where the microscope is put on everything. So if you take the time to insure impeccable tuning of each drum before the session starts you should really not have a problem regardless of head choices (remember when Gadd used hydraulics and got that great sound?).
Of course if you're doing a session where there's a budget and producer and you are basically a hired gun and they ask you to dampen then it's probably a specific type of sound they're looking for. So then I'd say just let them do what they want, smile and take the check. Most of those sessions I've done were on house kits anyway so it's usually not an issue for me. But if it's your band and your sound (and money)then work together with the engineer to get what YOU want. Play some then go listen. If they can point out something that sounds bad work together to clean it up. If it sounds acceptable to you then it becomes a matter of preference and a good engineer should never try to impose his on a client. There are still some techs out there who believe that dead is good and open and live is bad. They must really like that 70's sound. [img]eek.gif[/img]
I love the music of the era but, I hate when producer try to make my drums sound like a circa 1976 Gadd kit.
Yeah, definately a dated sound. I hope it never comes back into vogue. I'd hate to be considered radical again like back in those days. [img]eek.gif[/img]