The psycology of the freelance drummer

Well there seems to have been a lot of what I deem to be superficial topics being brought up on here recently such as "what does Vinnie wear?" where people are happy to debate Vinnie's tracksuit bottoms all day long, so I thought I'd ask the more discerning HODers their opinion on the psycology of what we do.

As a professional freelance drummer I supplement my playing by teaching at two schools, which I am enjoying more and more since I made a conscious effort to be more patient and less demanding on my students. That aside, I get booked to play in a wide variety of situations from pop gigs, to big bands, jazz, film and tv sessions, but recently I have been struggling with the whole "waiting for the phone to ring" thing. As I don't have my own band (I did have a quintet, but knocked it on the head due to no promoters/venues ever calling me back and the gigs I DID get, were to a bunch of old men who wanted to tap their feet along to 'All Of Me' all bloody evening! I know I should be more pro-active in getting gigs and I am trying to do so, by going to jam sessions and sitting in, having plays in the day with friends etc.

But my question is this: I have found it hard to deal with the whole psycology of getting and not getting gigs. Recently I have been questioning what it's all about and what the hell I am doing. I'm now 32 and have (without name-dropping) done some really nice work, but I am finding it hard not to analyse why I'm no longer playing with people I used to. I know that there will always be flavour of the month players who will go through periods of getting all the gigs, but in terms of jazz and pop gigs, it can be difficult to to rationalise why the phone can stop ringing for days.

You see, if you're passionate about music and really give a shit about what you play then it can be hard not to take it personally when you go through lean spells. Also, by the very nature of what we do, we can't ring up band leaders and ask them why they haven't rung you up to do a gig with them in a while or to ask your friends why they chose so and so over you. Don't get me wrong, it's not the green-eyed monster creeping in as I can honestly say that I'm friends with all my drumming peers and we all pass each other work, but due to the nature of being a self employed musician, it can be hard to get your head around and VERY easy to over-analyse why you are not at a level you would excpect to be, given the work the work and level that you have known in the past.

As I write this, I know that all it takes is one, just one phone call for a tour/session/ gig to come in and I'll be on cloud nine, grinning from ear to ear saying to myself, nice one - THIS is what it's all about! But it's the interim periods that can be difficult to deal with. Sometimes I think that it would be great to have a 9-5, where you go to work, do your day, come home, get your regular money and you know exactly where you are.

The life of a freelance musician can be the best in the world if you are playing with people you want to be playing with, making music that is challenging you, creating, improvising and developing yourself and your art. But when you are practicing for what seems like fuck-all reward, you wonder what it's all about and where your career will be in 10 years.

Sorry to get all morbid - I REALLY don't mean to and this isn't a sob story as believe it or not, I am busy with gigs at the moment and playing and recording with lots of different groups, but consider this post a reality check for myself and I'd be interested to hear your views.

Important and sobering questions Dazzler.

I played full-time for 20 years. But after the wife and kids came along...those lean periods were no longer about just myself getting by but about trying to care for my family.

So, for me the big question was, could I find something else that I could be passionate about, take care of my family and yet continue on with the music part of my life?

Since falling into the ranks of those with a day gig, I've still been able to pursue my musical aspirations, get some instruction from Dave and Hamilton, build up my arsenal of equipment, practice, study, teach and continue to make music contacts. And I've run into many musicians in the same boat...highly skilled and serious musicians who happen to work a day gig.

I still don't like the lean periods musically, but now they don't have the sting that they once did...when that was my only focus.

Intersting, cheers for your thoughts Andy and this is coming from a drummer that I respect having seen vids of your playing mate.

In any other field, it would be possible to get feedback from a boss or a colleague, but unless you're playing with mates, it's very difficult to assess how other musicians/band leaders/producers found your playing.

Wew are simply left to give ourselves an appraisal and so begins the inner turmoil of "did I do a good job? Will I get the call again?" ....etc etc etc

Well, I think ersko has pretty much covered it. I played the same mental games with myself years ago Dazz. I had done many great gigs, and worked with well respected musicians/songwriters etc., and even did a lot of drum programming, but then it started to become a 'job', in that I wasn't enjoying any of the music that I was playing. Once the work stared to slow down, I went back to school and now work full time in another field. I still play a lot (although I can't practice on a full kit in my current living situation) and it's still a big part of who I am.

I'm also actively involved with music in other areas of my life, and I have some ideas that I am pursuing that may bring in 'passive' income if they pan out. I think that if you can devote some time to thinking about other things that you have to offer that may start generating income for you, a lot of these psychological games will dissipate.

Over analyzing why your phone isn't ringing doesn't do you any good. I'm sure you're a fine player and great to work with. There are just a finite number of gigs out there.

Thanks Peter for that run down! The "that's the way I'm wired" concept seems to be the theme around here and at some point I seriously needed to make peace with that.

Cool feedback from Randy and DSOP also...interesting thread!

Great topic and great posts. [img]graemlins/thumbs_up.gif[/img]

I like when people speak candidly about life, that's when you learn the most.

What a great post Dazz.

I posted this in another thread about the recent suicide of one of our peers.

"I think if you are an artist in the most 'artistic' sense of the word, you are (by nature) a very sensative person. It comes with the territory. And with that comes blistering highs, but deep, deep lows.

They are inextricably linked, most musicians by our nature are very in touch with our emotions which can make it so hard at times. Couple that with job insecurity and the music business as a whole, we really set ourselves up for a rollercoaster of emotions. Lord knows I go through rough patches.

I am in my early 20's so thank the Lord I don't have to deal with too many commitments...yet. I can only hope when I have to make tough descisions, loved ones help make them easier to make.

MP

<font color="#a62a2a" size="1">[ April 09, 2005 02:02 PM: Message edited by: Groovemeister ]</font>

Wow - thanks firstly to Erskoman for your well thought out and eloquant post (as always!). It goes without saying that you have been a hero of mine since I started playing the drums and to have you be so frank is humbling.

It was interesting to read that even you you were established as one of the greats and clearly were getting offered more sessions and gigs than you knew what to do with, you didn't rest on your Laurals and hence, followed Fuzzy Music, your writing and other business ideas. That's something that musn't be ignored - it's no good being the tortured musician if you can't pay your bills and support a family!

Thanks to Randy, Andy and Groovemeister for your comments too. You know, sometimes I wish I was a builder or welder or sommat instead of being a creative musician, but then again when you are behind the kit and making music to a high level with people that are challenging you and elevating the art, then you sit back, smile to yourself and say now THAT'S why I went through all the hardship and anguish - coz THIS is where it's at!!

It would be good if it were all more regular though! [img]wink.gif[/img]

I have nothing to add but this, at Greg B clinics or gigs, he always seems to have family and friends with him. In short, a drum circle. I think have good drum buddies essential for the high and low times. As PE said, time is precious so spend it with quality people and...Eat the watermelon, spit out the seeds!

A very big question, Dazzler...

I'll begin by stating the obvious: music is its own reward. We make music simply because we must ... we want to, we like the results (most of the time, hopefully!), and there's a terrific gratification that comes from bringing pleasure to others through our work.

But being a free-lance musician requires a good deal of cleverness, creativity as well as dedication. By "dedication," I don't just mean practicing until the cows come home (or until you master some Virgil Donati double bass drum maneuver, etc.); rather, I mean the dedication that comes from believing so strongly in what you're doing that you'll persevere creatively, following your muse as well as providing for your family (or your own living expenses, reality being what it is ...).

When we last met in London, I was on tour with Diana Krall, playing some good music and making some good money; staying at good hotels, traveling in good comfort (and eating a lot of good food, I might add); in short, doing good work and getting good results. But, like anything else in life, there was a cost to enjoying all of that: it meant that I had to be away from home for extended periods of time. Now, when I was a younger man, this was not a gig-breaking predicament ... but, for the present moment (as of autumn, 2004), I found this to be a dilemma, as I was missing our daughter's final year at home before she heads off to college. And so I split the gig.

I made a similar type of decision when my wife and I were about to get married back in the mid-1980s ... I was doing very well in the New York City jazz scene, but circumstances did not seem to invite our setting up family and home in Manhattan (as my wife, who was living in Japan at the time, had friends in Los Angeles as opposed to New York, and my apartment was too small to raise a family, etc.).

Even when you have your picture on the cover of a drum magazine, it's not easy to pull up stakes and move to a new town, a new work scene, and renounce a way of life that was promising if not comfortable; still, you do what you got to do. I say all of this while realizing, with extreme gratitude, that I have been more than lucky and fortunate to be able to find work and make a living by playing the drums, etc.

Aahhh; the "etc." part!

Bob Beals was the owner of Evans Heads for many years, and he and I have been friends since the early 1970s ... anyway, one day Bob said to me "Peter, you travel an awful lot ... you know what? You need to start figuring out ways to make some money while you sleep!" And thus began a serious effort to put more energy and creativity into composing music, writing about music, and working with the drum industry on better products. Started my own CD "label," too. Etc.! All of which takes up a lot of valuable time.

Time. The essence of life; the moments of our days,, and the very gist of what we do as musicians!

So, then ... answers? Well, we all have to find our own way. But, I can offer the following:

1. Remember what it is about music that made you want to play in the first place. That magic will always be there if you remember to keep your ears and heart open to it.

2. Be prepared for any work opportunity that may come along. That means: know music! Know how to play, and know how to play with others! And, keep in mind: not all gigs will be good ones, and yet there is always something that can be learned from a playing opportunity or experience.

2.b. "Be prepared" means to be able to step up to the plate (as we say in America [baseball]) and deliver; confidence helps, as well as being open to suggestion (or, even, criticism).

3. Create your own musical reality or environment, if need be. I'm going to stay creative no matter what, whether I get called to do some big-deal gig or not, because I owe it to the music (and, frankly, that's the way I'm wired).

4. Keep the faith.

5. Life is precious, and life is short; spend it doing what you really want to do, and with the people you love.

6. Despite the (generally) low level of artistic taste or expectations that the public-at-large seems to share, thanks to all-mighty capitalism, there are people who will appreciate and understand your unique musical message. Sometimes it just takes some time and creative effort to make the match. Bottom line, and in other words: I don't know too many jazz musicians who are in it for the money.

All we can do is to do the best that we can ... add to that: "being kind to others," and I think you've got the main ingredients for a life that's being well-lived.

From a single-bass-drum-pedal-drummer ...

PE

nice words erskoman.

I'm not sure what I could really add to this, I am a fulltime player and all thru growing up never imagined doiong anything else even after getting married, having kids and the wife at times not happy with the 'lean' times and wanting me to get a day job.

Quote:

---

But my question is this: I have found it hard to deal with the whole psycology of getting and not getting gigs. I'm now 32 and have (without name-dropping) done some really nice work, but I am finding it hard not to analyse why I'm no longer playing with people I used to. it can be difficult to to rationalise why the phone can stop ringing for days.

---

<font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">I look at the phone not ringing and look around to what the economy is doing, producers I once worked with, in order for them to get the work are now scaling down and sometimes just using loops to create pieces because the budget is just not what it used to be, especially on low budget TV gigs or commercials where they need the music yesterday.
I keep up with all people via email/phone maybe once a week or every other week just as a "hey how's it going' thing, keeps your name in their ear.
Having my own studio also affords me to work on my own stuff as erskoman talked about writing one's own, or starting a label, I have not gone that far, but have fantasized about it.
Being able to do sound on the side has opened a few doors when say the wedding/corporate work is lean, I'm still doing what I love to do, work with music, maybe I am not always playing, but I am being creative.
Kinda how I looked at it when I still lived home in LA< when I was not playing my time would be filled say as a production assistant at Dick Clark, or at the Burbank Ranch........at least I was not dreading having to go to 'work' at say CircleK to make ends meet.

<font color="#a62a2a" size="1">[ April 16, 2005 01:47 PM: Message edited by: Henry II ]</font>

Quote:

---

Originally posted by Dazzler:
I am busy with gigs at the moment and playing and recording with lots of different groups

---

<font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Wait, is this about getting lean periods or is it actually just about not working with certain bandleaders? Because if you're gigging and recording with lots of different people, then I don't see a problem here dazz. There are tons of drummers who don't have ANY work and you're working. It's all relative, because any drummer that might have replaced you is no doubt going through, has gone through, or will go through lean periods as well and wondering the same thing you're pondering right now. You must be doing something right if you're working lots right now. I reckon it's because you're good. [img]tongue.gif[/img]
I personally wouldn't get too paranoid worrying why a bandleader doesn't call you anymore. If you know in your heart that you did a good job for any of those guys and acted professionally and courteously, then whatever reason they haven't be booking you lately will be no slate on you or your drumming. And I'm sure one or two of those bandleaders will ring you out of the blue offering you work, and you'll realise that you're worrying over nothing. I do think you need to find a musical outlet where you can simply enjoy the music you want to play, outside of the money gigs. I think that would achieve what erskoman was saying about remembering why you started playing drums. Rekindle the love affair with music and feel inspired again. [img]smile.gif[/img]

Don't get me wrong, I don't mean to seem like a petulant kid Rudy, I just meant that when you have been playing and working at a certain level and working with top prdoducers/artists, then for that to stop or for the gigs to dwindle, you obviously question why. Surely your playing can't have gone down the pan to such a degree that it warrants those people not ringing you up for sessions/gigs, or is this just the nature of what we do and we just have to lump it?

Neither am I sugessting that I have elevated myself to such a degree that I will only take on high profile work and sod all the functions, I am a working drummer and it is OBVIOUS that the functions pay the mortgage. But it's worrying that being a drummer involves constant worry, self analysis and needing approval. I'm not 22 and straight out of college any more and I can't go on saying to myself 'things will get better, these things take time'. I won't except that as I have a very high standard for myself every time I sit behind the kit.

There is a reason that you get called to for film/tv sessions and good gigs, so why do these calls get more sporadic? Why do you see other drummers playing with people that you played with for example? I know that artists are constantly changing their line ups and band members and it is extremely rare that bands keep the same line up for years, but still, it makes you think and it is this thinking a worrying that I am exploring here.
It is left for us to battle internally with trying figure this out and thus, we are on a constant rollercoater of emotions and thoughts that I guess is our lot in life - we CHOSE to be a drummer!!

Oh well ..... it's back to working for Pizza Hut!!

[img]wink.gif[/img]

Quote:

---

Originally posted by Dazzler:
. . . I'm not 22 and straight out of college any more. . . .

---

<font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Maybe that's the reason you're not getting as many calls. (I'm not talking about the boy band marketing to teenage girls with an allowance issue. No one can see your hairline in a commercial or TV score gig). It's common in EVERY industry, not just music. The older and more experienced you are, the more money you want. Older executives get laid off to make room for 22 year olds out of college who enthusiastically work like dogs for for 70 hours a week for peanuts. Experienced pros don't. Just a thought.

<font color="#a62a2a" size="1">[ April 10, 2005 10:56 AM: Message edited by: Henry II ]</font>

Dazz-

Your a great player and that phone is gonna be ringing again soon! I still love listening to your big band samples that you put up some time ago.

I felt compelled to share a bit of my story and why I stopped getting calls. This is no implication on Dazz, but I thought it worthy for those who are reading along and are at a young age. When I was younger, I have shared on other threads that I was pretty arrogant and selfish. That led to me being quite the whiner. I know, or at least I am pretty sure, that I lost a gig or two because of that area of myself.

It is rare that people lose their gig because of talent. Most bands are willing to work with a guy that has a great attitude,fun to be around and professional, even though he may not be the hottest player. I know this on several levels, especially since I have to hire drummers for me! I play guitar in our Church band and need a sub once in a while to drum. My usual drummer, Isy Nieves, is great and he is only 14! The guy who subs for him that has all of the above, but does not play fantastic is going to get the gig and the call back. I have heard of more people losing gigs because they could not control some area of themselves. Drug abuse, alcoholism, primadonna, jerk, always late. I lost mine back in the day, purely because of my own lousy attitude. I complained and whined and was just basically a real jerk to be around.

It's been years now and ever since, I have been thankful for every opportunity, thanked the contractor who hired me, telling him how great a time I had. I have arrived earlier and stayed later, all because I don't want to lose another gig the way that I had before.

Again, Dazz, this is no implication towards you or your situation. I just felt it important food for thought for the guys to have before the phone stops ringing. Said better, the phone will inevitably stop ringing for various reasons. Don't let it be because you were an unprofessional jerk with a drumming chip on your shoulder!

Take Care All. Stay the course Dazz.
F.S.

Great posts, guys! Nice, Ersk!

True RM. Besides any or all the many variables mentioned, it can also come down to the "chemistry of personalities" & attitudes.

...or even, although one may laugh - it may sound ridic - "quirks"...[Seinfeld made himself gazillions off making a TV sitcom about "nothing" but peoples quitks.] Or...Has anyone ever said anything humorous [not too brash either!] when they were younger in a setting that they later found someone took offense to, being overly sensitive to or uptight, w/out evn knowing it? Something one thought was harmless & an ice-breaker, or to bring a little tension-breaking levity? I have a couple of times. [In here even!] Some folks have VERY thin-skin, or are overly politically correct [& I'm not talking about making gender or race/ethnic comments either, that's not professional or social]. I try to pick & choose my jokes more carefuilly now, & read the situation better now! Play it safe first...also, I try to never take my "bad day" or fears into the pro setting, unless otherwise inclined after a good while. Or religion or politics - but I'm sure you're not even speaking of these aspects...but, just little common sense life stuff nevertheless for all the participants here.

Or even something as ridiculous as the way one looks...or also even, does one show up looking unkempt [not you Dazz, just in general! ;cp]...I realize one prob wouldn't have gone too far like this in the first place, but it's just thoughts.

As it's often been said, it's often "feast or famine" when you're solely a working pro muso. There were threads long ago about this; such as the MENTAL-PSYCHE CHESS GAME of our career choices...with both our career AWA our own SELVES...it's as much or more that than the pressure of actually playing at a pro level itself [which is enough], AWA all the aspects that go with that. Folks have mentioned those books such as the game of tennis one...

I too am near my mid-30s & am in an "in-between" phase, which many if not all of us have experienced or have yet to...I too have given thought to "should I give this up?"...but when it was good, it was good, & when it's lean, well...you folks know. I've been touring for the much-better part of a decade for 1 "artist"...it was a nerving thing when I left. Fear, anxiety; I've been out of the local club scene for quite a while [grew out of it anyway for all the reasons any of you may have AW, as I did it constantly for a living for 11 yrs prior to that, w the occasional sporadic special event or corp function]...but after almost a decade of commitment, for me there rapidly became no evidence of "light" at the end of that "tunnel" [except apparently[?!] for those partic "artists"].

the important thing is to stay BUSY awa focused on your decisions...busy not necessarily meaning entirely music, but maybe a little more predominantly so.

This is a great thread, one of the best ever. & there have been many of those over the years I've been in here. Another reason why this is such a heady forum.

<font color="#a62a2a" size="1">[ April 10, 2005 02:30 PM: Message edited by: got_a_matchgrip? ]</font>

Quote:

---

Originally posted by Rudy_Ment:
. . . Dazzler, since you can't ring up bandleaders to ask them why you're not being booked . . .

---

<font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Why not? Of course he can, and I think he should.

Dazz, I would pick someone you trust to be candid with you. There may be something going on you don't know about. If there several people that you think will be up front with you, I'd ask them all. You have nothing to loose.

<font color="#a62a2a" size="1">[ April 10, 2005 01:48 PM: Message edited by: Henry II ]</font>

Good one, Henry. [img]cool.gif[/img]

This is such a good post for me to read right now... it couldn't have come at a better time for me. Seriously, this is a post that really matters, and as i said, this has given me wonderful insight and cured some of my fears while reading this, as in... it does happen and will happen to everyone at one time or another.

Thanks everyone for being so candid about this, esp Dazz... goes to show what a great forum this is [img]biggrin.gif[/img]

It's wise of you to teach as an easy way to supplement your income for a good musician. Plus, you realize the value of being patient with your students. That makes them stick with you, since they know you're being supportive even when they have trouble or get a bit lazy or busy with other things.

Keep practicing, it's fun after all. There's nothing like getting a new thing down to the point you no longer think about it when you do it. The more patterns you master, the more you'll have to say on the gig.

You might consider trying to find some other ways to make money, just like Peter and Randy have done to fill in leaner times and take your mind off why the phone hasn't rung. I teach and write for some music magazines (I owned a studio for awhile too). Performing a variety of work can be more interesting than just doing one thing and totally relying on it. Good luck,

Brad

Matricks, cheers mate. I appreciate your comment. Maybe I could have been a bit more candid?!

EDIT: cheers Brad [img]wink.gif[/img]

<font color="#a62a2a" size="1">[ April 10, 2005 08:44 PM: Message edited by: Dazzler ]</font>

[img]graemlins/thumbs_up.gif[/img] [img]graemlins/beer.gif[/img]

Haha, looks like my post kind of went to waste or else it was taken as an insult. [img]confused.gif[/img]

Quote:

---

Originally posted by Rudy_Ment:
Haha, looks like my post kind of went to waste or else it was taken as an insult. [img]confused.gif[/img]

---

<font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Not at all Rudy - sometimes it takes TIME to reply to a post. Be patient! [img]wink.gif[/img]

You did, however make some good points and I agree with you. My playing won't be everyones cup of tea, clearly and I know that. I also know that there are simply better players out there than me. I also know that band leaders, producers and other musicians alike have all the freedom in the world to choose who they play and work with and it ain't always going to be me! (I'm not naive or arrogant enough to expect that too!)

It's as I said, a very personal thing we do and sometimes it's hard not to run yourself through the mill with regards to getting gigs and progressing your career. Along with the sheer joy of playing comes the down times when we are not. Unfortunately it's a double edged sword.

I don't think it was taken as an insult... i think it fit in just right, therefore no one had anything good or bad to say cause it fit [img]wink.gif[/img]

Rudy, what you mentioned reminds me of an interview...

I remember Paul Leim talking about having his feelings hurt when Steven Curtis Chapman used a different studio guy on his next album, instead of Paul (J.R. Robinson was used instead... he didn't SAY that, but he was the one who Steven used on the next album).

Paul has been on 250+ albums and he STILL talked about getting his feelings hurt when he didn't get the call back from someone whom he thought really enjoyed his playing.

Just goes to show that people are always going to want to try different flavors, just to see if maybe, just MAYBE, there is a better one out there. Another thing it shows is that the sting never really goes away, no matter how successful you are, when you are the one who gets passed over for someone else. Even though his (Paul's) phone always rings, he still shows that he notices when certain people decide to ring someone else's. With players who aren't doing sessions everyday (let alone maybe two or three a day), those times when we get passed over for a gig... those times will be bigger drops in a relatively smaller bucket. But even those with very big buckets still feel it, it still creates ripples. It is hard when work isn't there, but that sting is even worse when someone is playing 'your gig' while you are sitting on the sidelines.

No matter how you cut it, it still sucks [img]frown.gif[/img]

Alright then dazzler well I was only trying to help. You seemed to answer the other people very quickly but actually looked like you didn't want to answer mine because you didnt think it was of any benefit or, perhaps you don't respect much that I have to say. I thought you were sort of asking for real solutions because you said 'my question is this..' and you said 'but I am finding it hard not to analyse why I'm no longer playing with people I used to'. Then you say you know all these things. So why are you analysing what you already know? I'm confused. I was merely pointing out things that you may not have thought about but I get the impression you took it as an insult instead of a real world way of looking at the actual possible reasons. Now I'm not sure if you were asking a question or philosophising. I'll just keep me gob shut in future, hehe [img]tongue.gif[/img]

[img]tongue.gif[/img] <----- Leavin' that there for the inside joke! [img]wink.gif[/img]

<font color="#a62a2a" size="1">[ April 10, 2005 10:35 PM: Message edited by: matricks ]</font>

When I was in High School, the drumline went to a perc. camp at West Virginia Univ., which at the time had a stellar perc. department.

One of the graduating drummers was a laid back guy as well as a fantastic drummer. His advice to us was to not choose music as a major. I was definitely leaning that way and with my grades, I might as well have done it. I was doing more playing than studying in college among other things. [img]tongue.gif[/img]

Now that I am nearing 40, I can see the wisdom in his words. I didn't at the time, but he did not strike me as a totally cynical person, just a realist in the realm of getting paid dollars for a service.

But if someone would have told Steve Smith that, he'd never be where he is today. But if he had a freak accident and lost the use of a hand before he got into Ponty or Montrose, he wouldn't be either.

Best of luck Dazz wherever your introspection takes you. Time can't be reasoned with.

It's a possibility henry but I somehow doubt that's the case. Bandleaders want people they can trust and do a good job and if they know dazzler has done exactly that then why would they not book him continuously? They don't swap vinnie for some college kid because they can save a bit of money because they know who will do the best job.

Let's look at this in a no holes barred and brutally honest way, being as that's what we do at HoD, give honest criticism, or in this case, merely thoughts.

As drummers we ALL know there's other drummers that are better than us and worse than us and the same as us. Dazzler, since you can't ring up bandleaders to ask them why you're not being booked, the stuff I'm saying below is just the questions I would ask myself and try and answer absolutely honestly to myself if I was trying to find out all the possibilities. I'm sure they don't apply to you at all and I'm very confident it's nothing more than a lean spell and that those guys are very happy with you. Nevertheless, these questions might be worth thinking about. And I hope you don't think I'm outta line for suggesting these, since it's just my over analytical and sometimes paranoid mind that comes up with this stuff.

What if bandleaders were booking other drummers that are simply better or, more suitable than the one they've been using but without that meaning that the first drummer wasn't doing a good job anyway? eg, if ricky lawson gets booked over john robinson, we know that doesn't make JR a bad drummer. It doesn't reflect on him, but it means ricky was more suitable for that job at that particular time.

What if those drummers are clocking the dots and nailing the grooves and making no mistakes on gigs, or laying down tracks perfectly in the studio in the absolute shortest time possible? I'm not saying you're not doing these things perfectly dazzler, I'm sure you are. But I don't know what really goes on when you're in the studio or on a gig. You did however once say that you were doing a pop gig and the bandleader gave you a funny look when the time went a bit wobbly. Well, I don't personally think something like that would be a huge problem. Then again, it all depends on the level of the gig. Maybe they're used to absolute perfection? Again, just food for thought.

What if those bandleaders know one drummer is simply better for groove stuff and the other is simply better for swing?


What if a bandleader loves the drumming but doesn't really click with the drummer on a social level?

What if they just prefer the aftershave of one drummer over the other? [img]tongue.gif[/img]

Quote:

---

Originally posted by Rudy_Ment:
...I get the impression you took it as an insult ...

---

<font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Um, as an outside observer in this fascinating thread, I certainly did not get the impression that Dazz felt that way. And I do often find it very easy to be wound up by Dazz's posts... [img]wink.gif[/img]

Art Blakey used to say that if you don't appear, you disappear. I find that if I'm off the scene, some folks tend to forget about me. I also find that if I hit a jam session of hang a week or so, the phone rings in a few weeks, inevitably from someone who remembered seeing me at a jam session or at a gig. I don't hit the same place week after week; folks get tired of one otherwise. I make a point of meeting new folks, or folks I haven't seen in a while, regularly. The more seeds you cast, the more crops will grow.

Also, I've experienced that given competence, people call whom they know, trust, and like. Once you've a good grasp on your craft, your ability to relate to the people around you and help them feel comfortable becomes increasingly important. This is not to say that one must develop a brown nose. However, if we are proficient, dependable, and easy to work with, the likelihood of the phone ringing increases. Relationship skills become increasingly important. And that means maintaining old relationships and developing new ones.

Hope this helps,

Quote:

---

It's as I said, a very personal thing we do and sometimes it's hard not to run yourself through the mill with regards to getting gigs and progressing your career. Along with the sheer joy of playing comes the down times when we are not. Unfortunately it's a double edged sword

---

<font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">TRUE, THAT.

Hence, the Mental Chess Game with both your career AWA your own self.

As mat said, sometimes folks are just interested in trying new additions [players] to their sometimes changing sound or style.

Quote:

---

Um, as an outside observer in this fascinating thread, I certainly did not get the impression that Dazz felt that way. And I do often find it very easy to be wound up by Dazz's posts...

---

<font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Ha ha...NAAHH, ya think?! /;cp

Exactly, good one by Rid; he just said basically what i was trying to in my first post here... [img]confused.gif[/img] [img]redface.gif[/img] ;c) [img]graemlins/thumbs_up.gif[/img]

Good AWA applicable thread reading...

<font color="#a62a2a" size="1">[ April 11, 2005 03:39 PM: Message edited by: got_a_matchgrip? ]</font>

I apologised to dazzler by pm, because frankly, I was out of order with my last comments.
[img]redface.gif[/img]

Good, cause me and Dazz were secretly planning on kicking your arse if you didn't [img]tongue.gif[/img] [img]wink.gif[/img] [img]tongue.gif[/img]

Not a problem Rudy, If I may quote my reply to your pm:

It IS difficult to gague the tone of peoples posts here sometime - and I KNOW that I can be a sarcastic son of a ***** too!! [img]rolleyes.gif[/img] No? Really?!! But not however, with this topic as you can tell.

I DO and DID value your opinions mate and appreciate your frank response.

.....there ya go, all friends together - nice!! [img]biggrin.gif[/img]

LOL matricks! [img]graemlins/thumbs_up.gif[/img]

<font color="#a62a2a" size="1">[ April 11, 2005 09:24 PM: Message edited by: Dazzler ]</font>

[img]wink.gif[/img]

wow this is the first topic i read as a new member and i like this board already..

few things...

im only 17. i was accepted into berklee but i decided not to go till next year. the main reason is because alot of doors are starting to open up for me here in atlanta. i owe most of that to my mentor/teacher/friend chris coleman.

anyway. im going to college to be a professional musician. i am grateful to have read this thread to have found out about the problems that we musicians face. i also am grateful for the fact that since i now know about these things i can prepare to get through tough times, especially when the phone does not ring.

what i have learned about alot of musicians, not you all because i dont really know any of you. but what i have learned is that people when they get a little bit of money they go and buy that corvette they always wanted, or they buy that big house. etc. i think through this observation i will be better equiped to know how to manage/invest my money.

i started thinking like this when i got my income tax and i spent the whole thing on mainly drum stuff in the same day. i met up with my teacher afterwards and he asked if something was wrong and i just said i couldnt believe that i had spent so much money in so little time. then he asked what i bought, i told him. then he asked me, "did you need this/that" at the end i could have saved about 2/3rds of the money i had if i had only bought what i needed and not what i wanted.

not meaning to rant but just something i wanted to share..

Managing money is important, and if you've learned that at 17 you're way ahead of the game.

True Vdrummer.

drumzalicious, welcome to the board matey - we look forward to hearing you play sometime! [img]wink.gif[/img]