Should we not....

Do you think it is wrong to warn about different religions and the pit-falls that they are involved in? I am not a "Bigot" or anything but I believe we should warn people. In my opinion you can follow what ever you wish but at the same time when you are trying to influence someone to join but the doctrine just is not anywhere near being sound... should we not sound the alarm? Or should we just mind our own business and allow it to take its course? [img]/LDPforum/ubbthreads/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/confused.gif[/img]

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Pac-Man</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Do you think it is wrong to warn about different religions and the pit-falls that they are involved in? </div></div>

IMO, warnings, opinions, etc. should always be offered within the context of relationship (i.e., I think we're all more apt to listen to someone's thoughts or opinions if we have first established a relationship with that individual).

Pac-Man, think of it this way and read what I say, don't just discard it offhanded. You're going to warn others...thats fine...but our religion is based on a book (written by multiple people), translated by various people (and rulers), that requires us to have faith in something unseen. Yes, I believe it and you do, thats not the point. Ok, we are saved, we die we go to Heaven. That is part of the faith in Christianity, or a really quick summation, right? Ok someone is Muslim, they believe that they serve Allah, they die they are with him. That is their faith. You can sit there and say but I have the Bible and I know its true. They will sit there and say I have the Koran I know its true. This is the point I tried to make to you way back. I'm sure that there is a 'Muslim' version of you who thinks that they should alert all of us Christians to the pitfalls of our religion too. And you can't say that our religion doesn't have some built in pitfalls and beliefs required too. You saying well I read the Bible and know its true, is great but just because YOU believe something and have yourself convinced its true, doesn't mean that someone is going to think the same as you.

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: R0cketer</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Pac-Man, think of it this way and read what I say, don't just discard it offhanded. You're going to warn others...thats fine...but our religion is based on a book (written by multiple people), translated by various people (and rulers), that requires us to have faith in something unseen. Yes, I believe it and you do, thats not the point. Ok, we are saved, we die we go to Heaven. That is part of the faith in Christianity, or a really quick summation, right? Ok someone is Muslim, they believe that they serve Allah, they die they are with him. That is their faith. You can sit there and say but I have the Bible and I know its true. They will sit there and say I have the Koran I know its true. This is the point I tried to make to you way back. I'm sure that there is a 'Muslim' version of you who thinks that they should alert all of us Christians to the pitfalls of our religion too. And you can't say that our religion doesn't have some built in pitfalls and beliefs required too. You saying well I read the Bible and know its true, is great but just because YOU believe something and have yourself convinced its true, doesn't mean that someone is going to think the same as you.

</div></div>

Yes you are right about a lot of what you have said here... but all I am saying is put the word out there... because it is not my job to convince people it is the job of the Holy Spirit to do that...So I just feel the need to get it out there.. I cn not determine if someone will recieve it or reject it though.

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: boney</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Pac-Man</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Do you think it is wrong to warn about different religions and the pit-falls that they are involved in? </div></div>

IMO, warnings, opinions, etc. should always be offered within the context of relationship (i.e., I think we're all more apt to listen to someone's thoughts or opinions if we have first established a relationship with that individual). </div></div>


Yes I agree... we would have more trust in what someone is saying when we have created a relationship with them. But this is a board and I do not know a lot of people on here. I probably do but not by their nicknames. But don't you think it is kind of hard to really get to know someone on here... we cant see each other.. we just right back and forth on the posts?

Any religion has pitfalls if it is organized...cuz through organization the church tells you what to believe, and dictates to you how to believe it. Any man that can read can look at scripture and get his or her own meaning from it...they don't need it dictated and spoonfed to them.

Who is successful to minister to someone? John in Kansas who just shows up and tells them something or the neighbor they know, and whom they have seen the fruits they bare.

Just myself, I understand that I have a better chance to get someone who isn't any religion to believe me than someone who is in another religion.

I mean look at it this way, most people have a strong opinion about Jehovah's Witnesses. Most are completely against them. Why? Is it because they are another religion or is the strong-arming techniques they use?

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: sup-rbeast</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Any religion has pitfalls if it is organized...cuz through organization the church tells you what to believe, and dictates to you how to believe it. Any man that can read can look at scripture and get his or her own meaning from it...they don't need it dictated and spoonfed to them. </div></div>

Oh yes I fully agree.. but to say that the Bible has flaws is another thing... it says that it is infalliable.. I understand through translations meanings can and will get lost... that is why it is important to Check the original meanings of words and scriptures.

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: R0cketer</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Who is successful to minister to someone? John in Kansas who just shows up and tells them something or the neighbor they know, and whom they have seen the fruits they bare.

Just myself, I understand that I have a better chance to get someone who isn't any religion to believe me than someone who is in another religion.

I mean look at it this way, most people have a strong opinion about Jehovah's Witnesses. Most are completely against them. Why? Is it because they are another religion or is the strong-arming techniques they use? </div></div>

The neighbor will be more successful.It is because of their beliefs and their doctrine that they spread... it is insane. What strong arming techniques? They do go door to door but that is not a bad thing is it?

There are flaws in the bible..it may have been dictated by god originally..but it has been redictated by tyrants and rulers ever since...it has been purged of passages deemed "inappropriate" by earthly kings... Since no one is perfect by your own admission, the bible must have flaws...but they are caused by mankind...

[/quote] But don't you think it is kind of hard to really get to know someone on here... we cant see each other.. we just right back and forth on the posts? [/quote]

Exactly. Which is why I'm reluctant to express my thoughts on alot of topics. Also, it's near impossible to include nuances, humor, etc. with the written word.

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: sup-rbeast</div><div class="ubbcode-body">There are flaws in the bible..it may have been dictated by god originally..but it has been redictated by tyrants and rulers ever since...it has been purged of passages deemed "inappropriate" by earthly kings... Since no one is perfect by your own admission, the bible must have flaws...but they are caused by mankind...
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Exactly what I was trying to say... appreciate it. [img]/LDPforum/ubbthreads/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/wink.gif[/img]

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: boney</div><div class="ubbcode-body">[/quote] But don't you think it is kind of hard to really get to know someone on here... we cant see each other.. we just right back and forth on the posts? </div></div>

Exactly. Which is why I'm reluctant to express my thoughts on alot of topics. Also, it's near impossible to include nuances, humor, etc. with the written word. [/quote]

Yes it is but I am just being free and at the same time trying to be respectful... just open up... be yourself... over a period of time we will understand each other better.. heck we can even go get a milkshake from Dairy Queen if you want... you can buy [img]/LDPforum/ubbthreads/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/grin.gif[/img]

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: sup-rbeast</div><div class="ubbcode-body">There are flaws in the bible..it may have been dictated by god originally..but it has been redictated by tyrants and rulers ever since...it has been purged of passages deemed "inappropriate" by earthly kings... Since no one is perfect by your own admission, the bible must have flaws...but they are caused by mankind...
</div></div>
Do you really think an all-knowing, all-powerful, all-seeing, all-righteous God would allow man to mess up His Word? I don't think so. Man has not preserved God's Word over the ages...God has!

Agreed, It`s more like the bible was written by the holy spirit. Yes, men put it down on paper but it was basically god speaking through these men.
I know I may be persecuted for this but I do agree a lot with what Pac-Man has to say on here. [img]/LDPforum/ubbthreads/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/laugh.gif[/img] Although coming across as a little hard headed sometimes [img]/LDPforum/ubbthreads/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/grin.gif[/img]. I have agreed with Ut1 on every religous discussion I can ever remember.
Man should work out their own relationship with the lord. Read, study the bible, pray. Don`t let other people mold you into a christian. Am I saying you shouldn`t listen to your pastor or other christians on their opinions on ascripture? NO. I'm saying after hearing their opinion read and study it for yourself.
I like to read this religous forum. Does somebody asking a ton of questions trying find a loop hole in the scripture going to change my beliefs? Nope. Nobody has a complete knowledge of the bible(until reaching heaven). It can be read by 10 people and be interpreted 10 different ways. BUT like I said earlier each person should work out their own relationship with god.

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Zebra</div><div class="ubbcode-body">BUT like I said earlier each person should work out their own relationship with god. </div></div>

Smartest thing ever posted on the Religion Forum.

Co-sign and agree whole-heartedly.

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: ut1</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: sup-rbeast</div><div class="ubbcode-body">There are flaws in the bible..it may have been dictated by god originally..but it has been redictated by tyrants and rulers ever since...it has been purged of passages deemed "inappropriate" by earthly kings... Since no one is perfect by your own admission, the bible must have flaws...but they are caused by mankind...
</div></div>
Do you really think an all-knowing, all-powerful, all-seeing, all-righteous God would allow man to mess up His Word? I don't think so. Man has not preserved God's Word over the ages...God has! </div></div>


Yes I see where you are coming from... but not speaking for supe-rbeast but I think he meant that men try to change it and pollute it... and they do.. but you are right God will always remain in control.. every atempt through the years of someone trying to misinterupt his word he sets the record straight... but that does not maean that people will not attempt to do it out of ignorance or something.

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Zebra</div><div class="ubbcode-body"> Agreed, It`s more like the bible was written by the holy spirit. Yes, men put it down on paper but it was basically god speaking through these men.
I know I may be persecuted for this but I do agree a lot with what Pac-Man has to say on here. [img]/LDPforum/ubbthreads/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/laugh.gif[/img] Although coming across as a little hard headed sometimes [img]/LDPforum/ubbthreads/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/grin.gif[/img]. I have agreed with Ut1 on every religous discussion I can ever remember.
Man should work out their own relationship with the lord. Read, study the bible, pray. Don`t let other people mold you into a christian. Am I saying you shouldn`t listen to your pastor or other christians on their opinions on ascripture? NO. I'm saying after hearing their opinion read and study it for yourself.
I like to read this religous forum. Does somebody asking a ton of questions trying find a loop hole in the scripture going to change my beliefs? Nope. Nobody has a complete knowledge of the bible(until reaching heaven). It can be read by 10 people and be interpreted 10 different ways. BUT like I said earlier each person should work out their own relationship with god.

</div></div>

Dude you are the bomb [img]/LDPforum/ubbthreads/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/cool.gif[/img] I agree no one knows everything about God.. we are never going to until we reach the streets of gold. Dude you done messed up now.. you will be tied to a stake...and beaten for saying you agree with me [img]/LDPforum/ubbthreads/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/grin.gif[/img]No seriously you are right everyone should have their own personal relationship with god... but discussing is fun also.. I know it helps me.. after being on here for a day I must pray hard [img]/LDPforum/ubbthreads/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/grin.gif[/img] No just kidding.. but it does make me search even deeper... so thanks for giving us your wisdom.

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: CoeburnCane</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Zebra</div><div class="ubbcode-body">BUT like I said earlier each person should work out their own relationship with god. </div></div>

Smartest thing ever posted on the Religion Forum.

Co-sign and agree whole-heartedly. </div></div>

Come on now I have posted smarter stuff than that.. lol [img]/LDPforum/ubbthreads/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/grin.gif[/img] [img]/LDPforum/ubbthreads/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/whistle.gif[/img]

God has always spoke his word through men. Whether it be preachers, prophets, disciples, evangelists. His word never changes, he is the same as yesterday, today and tomorrow. God's word will reach all around the world, for he does not want anyone to die lost in their sins. But as with the story in the old testament with the poor man Lazarus and the rich man. There came a day when both passed away from earth and upon death the poor man was in the bosom of Abraham and the rich man in Hades(HELL). The rich man begged for a drop of water, then he called unto Abraham to please goto his house and warn his family(brothers) of this terrible place so they would not die lost and come there. Abraham told him they have the scriptures to read and the prophets to hear, if they will not believe either one of those then how are they going to believe now?
You see people are led astray because they lean unto their own understanding about everything in life. Why is it so hard to call upon God and ask him to show a man what is right and wrong? God doesn't want any man decieved. No man will stand before God and say they didn't know the truth, cause God says pray unto him and he will open our blinded eyes and deaf ears. God will guide you where you will hear his word and send you where he wants you to be. His word will not just be a bunch of words in a book to read. God will open your heart and you will read his word like never before, this time with spiritual eyes and you will have a better understanding of it. God will teach you and show you what is right. God wants his children to make up a body, his body. God wants his children to gather together because this edifies the church. If there is one who is lost and they are seeking after the real truth no matter what it is, then I would say unto you to please pray unto God, he will hear you.

I was raised in church and knew many bible stories, but until I was in my 20's and God spoke to my heart did I really open my eyes to his word and his ways. Many things I never really was taught as a kid did I understand then. Mostly was the Power of God (The Holy Spirit). I was taught about God and Jesus but not about the holy spirit. I found it interesting how in the days of Jesus' time, many did not believe in the savior but yet they believed in miracles. Today many believe in Jesus as a savior but they don't believe in his power (The Holy Spirit). The Holy Spirit is what teaches man the heart of God.

Throughout time there have been entire books purged from the bible and several books taken from the canon because either a pope or a ruler didn't agree with them. In addition, editions of the bible have been comissioned several times by powerful groups or rulers..(King James)...in these editions scholars and translators were under coercion of various degrees to put in writing not what the word expressly said, but what the patron of the translation wanted it to say (or which way they wanted it slanted)...so yes..I do think man has altered the bible.

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: sup-rbeast</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Throughout time there have been entire books purged from the bible and several books taken from the canon because either a pope or a ruler didn't agree with them. In addition, editions of the bible have been comissioned several times by powerful groups or rulers..(King James)...in these editions scholars and translators were under coercion of various degrees to put in writing not what the word expressly said, but what the patron of the translation wanted it to say (or which way they wanted it slanted)...so yes..I do think man has altered the bible. </div></div>

Must agree with you, my liberal pal. However, it would behoove any of us to research and study 2 things: 1. the original languages, and 2. the hebraic culture in which it was written. In particular, the latter point is extremely important. It is very difficult, it not impossible, for an individual to correctly interpret and understand Scripture without doing so within the context of the Hebrew culture. You and I have a greco-roman mindset, which, as your research will show, is very different from that of the Hebrews.

Researching scripture is the furthest of my concerns...i'm just pointing out why the bible can't always be taken literally since alot of folks on here spout scripture 24-7.

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: sup-rbeast</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Researching scripture is the furthest of my concerns...i'm just pointing out why the bible can't always be taken literally since alot of folks on here spout scripture 24-7. </div></div>

OK, bro, tell me how you can make such a blanketing statemet. What are your credentials? You know Greek/Aramaic/hebrew? You certainly must have a vast educatioanl experience to be able to make such broad, sweeping statements. Provide some research-based, solid info/facts to support your mindsets. Given the fact that the Bible can't be taken literally...where are your facts. If you have none, at least preface your comments with "IMO".

Read my previous posts and you should be able to see why it wouldn't be wise to construe the bible literally...

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: sup-rbeast</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Read my previous posts and you should be able to see why it wouldn't be wise to construe the bible literally... </div></div>

Answer my post, and then I'll construe what is best for me...you don't think I should hold a literal interpretation of the Bible; I ask what credentials do you have to convince me of that. Obviously, your creentials are limited but your opinion is lengthy. I place n value in the opinion of any man.

Well, i'm not about to rehash 5 or 10 posts that explain what i have said all over again.

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: sup-rbeast</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Researching scripture is the furthest of my concerns...i'm just pointing out why the bible can't always be taken literally since alot of folks on here spout scripture 24-7. </div></div>

If you are a Christian or even aspire to be then researching scripture should be one of the foremost of your concerns. The Dead Sea scrolls verified writings that were in doubt by some, since questions such as yours has arisen in the past. The Word has still survived.
Again, are you trying to tell me that God would allow man to pervert His Word to the point of misleading the masses to accomplish man's goals? I don't serve a God that is that weak.

If you are a Christian or even aspire to be then researching scripture should be one of the foremost of your concerns. The Dead Sea scrolls verified writings that were in doubt by some, since questions such as yours has arisen in the past. The Word has still survived.
Again, are you trying to tell me that God would allow man to pervert His Word to the point of misleading the masses to accomplish man's goals? I don't serve a God that is that weak. [/quote]

The dogmatic individuals will never let truth interfere with opinion! lol

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: juggernaut28</div><div class="ubbcode-body">God has always spoke his word through men. Whether it be preachers, prophets, disciples, evangelists. His word never changes, he is the same as yesterday, today and tomorrow. God's word will reach all around the world, for he does not want anyone to die lost in their sins. But as with the story in the old testament with the poor man Lazarus and the rich man. There came a day when both passed away from earth and upon death the poor man was in the bosom of Abraham and the rich man in Hades(HELL). The rich man begged for a drop of water, then he called unto Abraham to please goto his house and warn his family(brothers) of this terrible place so they would not die lost and come there. Abraham told him they have the scriptures to read and the prophets to hear, if they will not believe either one of those then how are they going to believe now?
You see people are led astray because they lean unto their own understanding about everything in life. Why is it so hard to call upon God and ask him to show a man what is right and wrong? God doesn't want any man decieved. No man will stand before God and say they didn't know the truth, cause God says pray unto him and he will open our blinded eyes and deaf ears. God will guide you where you will hear his word and send you where he wants you to be. His word will not just be a bunch of words in a book to read. God will open your heart and you will read his word like never before, this time with spiritual eyes and you will have a better understanding of it. God will teach you and show you what is right. God wants his children to make up a body, his body. God wants his children to gather together because this edifies the church. If there is one who is lost and they are seeking after the real truth no matter what it is, then I would say unto you to please pray unto God, he will hear you.

I was raised in church and knew many bible stories, but until I was in my 20's and God spoke to my heart did I really open my eyes to his word and his ways. Many things I never really was taught as a kid did I understand then. Mostly was the Power of God (The Holy Spirit). I was taught about God and Jesus but not about the holy spirit. I found it interesting how in the days of Jesus' time, many did not believe in the savior but yet they believed in miracles. Today many believe in Jesus as a savior but they don't believe in his power (The Holy Spirit). The Holy Spirit is what teaches man the heart of God. </div></div>


Yes God has spoken through people and he still does... in the Old Testament he spoke through his prophets and now in the new testament he speaks through his people by the Holy Spirit.The story about the Rich man and Lazauras is a good one... the sad part is a lot of people choose not to believe or change until it is to late.. just like with him we cannot go back and warn people that there is a fiery helll that awaits those who do not trust in Jesus.God does not want us decieved.. you are right.. and that is why it is important that we study the Bible to find out who God is. My story is about like yours.. it was not until late in my life that I really knew what a relationship with God was.. but thank od he showed me.

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: sup-rbeast</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Researching scripture is the furthest of my concerns...i'm just pointing out why the bible can't always be taken literally since alot of folks on here spout scripture 24-7. </div></div>

Sup-rbeast come on now... I hope you did not mean that to say you do not care about studying the Bible. Every scripture can not be taken literally but a lot of it can though. Let me share with you a little story.. you might have heard this before... buthere it goes.. There was the Indian Chief and he lived on a farm.. he had 2 dogs that fought all the time... one day a customer walked in to the store to buy some feed for his cattle and as he was walking by the 2 dogs were fighting.. so the man goes in and says to the Indian.. " hEY your dogs are fighting and they are going to kill one another".. so the Indian chief says " It is okay they do that all the time... so 2 weeks later the same man comes back and as he walks by the dogs.. one dog was dead and the other standing over it... so the man walks in and says one of the dogs are dead... which one won? THe Indian said the one that I fed the most... there is a moral to this little story... spiritually we have 2 dogs fighting on the inside of us waging against one another.. it is our flesh and our spirit.. and the one that you feed the most is going to win out... that is why it is important to feed our SPirit the Word of God and as we do this that dog becomes the strongest and will overcome our fleshly habits and thoughts... but the same is true if we neglect to put the word of od into us our flesh will win us over. So I encourage you to pray for a desire to study Gods word and he will give it to you... and I can assure you or anyone else that if you do that od will bless you and enlighten us through his word... The word of God is a lamp unto our feet and a light unto our path... allow it to lead the way for you. God bless you.

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: boney</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: sup-rbeast</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Read my previous posts and you should be able to see why it wouldn't be wise to construe the bible literally... </div></div>

Answer my post, and then I'll construe what is best for me...you don't think I should hold a literal interpretation of the Bible; I ask what credentials do you have to convince me of that. Obviously, your creentials are limited but your opinion is lengthy. I place n value in the opinion of any man. </div></div>

In my opinion there are a lot of scriptures in the Bible than can be taken literally... there are hypothetical scriptures.. analogies.. and so on... we will begin to recognize this more as we study more... I have been studying the Bible for years and still I learn everyday. I will give a few examples to support literal scriptures... Pray those who persecute you... we are to literally pray for those who perecute us...Forgive our trepasses as we forgive those who trespass against us... this is literal... and there are a lot more of these... But check this one out.. Paul says in Corinthians even though I speak the tongues of many angels if I have not love... well see this is a hypathetical statement.. It is like saying even though I have 1 million dollars but I do not feed the hungry what good does it do... I hope that helps us all.

every atempt through the years of someone trying to misinterupt his word he sets the record straight.

Ok where is the record straight on wine? You have entire religious denominations that will disagree with what you said, about it being wine or not wine.

God doesn't allow man to pervert his word? So God gives man a choice, God even mentions people speaking falsely but yet that doesn't mean there is 'changing' of what he meant? C'mon people, to me that is exactly what God meant, that some will speak falsely about his word, construe the meaning.

Yes we have to learn what it means ourselves, but if someone views it as being wine and some view it as not being wine, I don't think either of them is going to hell (or at least just due to that)

That is exactly what I said and that is exactly what I meant...Just because all of these topics are important to you guys, doesn't mean all of them are important to me...I give my opinions from time to time...which in itself seems to infuriate some of you guys...but my views are my views...and that's what I write about.

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: R0cketer</div><div class="ubbcode-body">every atempt through the years of someone trying to misinterupt his word he sets the record straight.

Ok where is the record straight on wine? You have entire religious denominations that will disagree with what you said, about it being wine or not wine.

God doesn't allow man to pervert his word? So God gives man a choice, God even mentions people speaking falsely but yet that doesn't mean there is 'changing' of what he meant? C'mon people, to me that is exactly what God meant, that some will speak falsely about his word, construe the meaning.

Yes we have to learn what it means ourselves, but if someone views it as being wine and some view it as not being wine, I don't think either of them is going to hell (or at least just due to that)
</div></div>

The record for right or wrong on wine is in the epistles... in the word of God.. it is pretty easy to interupt... it is not an alogory or anything else it simply says what it means. YOu are right I do not believe hell awaits either... but listen Gods word is infalliable... not to say people do not misrepresent it or teach it falsley... but through discernment and common sense sometimes... and the studu of the Holy Bible we can defeat the lies of the enemy. SOme do it unknowingly and some do it [purposely.

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: sup-rbeast</div><div class="ubbcode-body">That is exactly what I said and that is exactly what I meant...Just because all of these topics are important to you guys, doesn't mean all of them are important to me...I give my opinions from time to time...which in itself seems to infuriate some of you guys...but my views are my views...and that's what I write about. </div></div>

I appreciate you giving your views.. whether we agree with them or not... I encourage you to continue to give them. I also encourage you to just open your heart on some things.. by theway did you play on the 91 Coeburn team? [img]/LDPforum/ubbthreads/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/smirk.gif[/img]

Nope...played against em from 88-90 tho.

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: sup-rbeast</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Nope...played against em from 88-90 tho. </div></div>

Did you play for APPY? Did you get my qustion oon the pm?

Nope..played for PV...and I didn't get a PM..

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: sup-rbeast</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Nope..played for PV...and I didn't get a PM.. </div></div>

I sent it.. I will send you another...