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I think both boards can agree that the only thing that can set things right and fix the school systems short falls is........ANOTHER STUDY :)
In all honisty with one board member calling for home schooling as an alternative to to Consoladation or even renovation it shows me that some board members are clueless......IMHO WC will end up with what amouts to the Bashem Plan from a few years ago (More and more it seems like that man knew what he was doing)
Basham wasn't the first to talk consolidation..that was going on as early as the late 80s. He just got the albatross hung around his neck for trying to see it through. Really he's not a bad guy..as anyone familiar with him would attest. One thing we can all agree on is that this issue needs to be settled in an equitable manner..and the only way to do that is through a countywide vote. Money is the reason for both action and inaction on this issue. So, IMO, county residents should be TRUTHFULLY informed on what it will cost to consolidate and what it will cost to continue to operate six high schools. Any grants or aid available for each proposition should be revealed as well. Then, residents should be presented the total cost for each plan PER TAXPAYER PER YEAR PER EVERY $5000 OF GROSS INCOME(that way total cost will be shared by all residents based on income)..and stress that no taxpayer will be exempt for his or her share for any reason. Then you will see how many folks are willing to put their money where their mouth is. And then, let the residents decide in November. That is the only fair way to go about this issue...the school system should have to open their books to show where their money has gone over the past decade, because really they haven't presented any evidence which either proves the dire financial situation of the county schools or a concrete net savings annual amount that consolidation would supposedly provide. They just expect us to swallow everything they tell us just because they say so. And, that's not how to win support for this issue. In this amount they should consider the initial cost as well. IMO There is something in the books the school system is trying to hide. Whether it is past allocation of funds or evidence that shoots down the consolidation argument..who knows. But there's something there they don't want folks to see or they would have already opened them by now. But, they need to understand that what they are trying to do is the same as if someone was trying to sell a house for an unknown price. And, all they had to show the potential buyer was a badly drawn picture. That's an impossible sell..and until the county school system becomes transparent with their finances and speaks honestly to the residents on the actual costs associated with this issue, the whole thing will remain a no go. It's time to quit the whining, biotching, and excuses on both sides and put this before the county voters in November or sooner.
You always supply some interesting points and well thought out. I did think, however, that a referendum was not legal on this issue. A bond issue would be, but not the vote for yes or no on consolidation. I could be wrong. Always like reading your thoughts.
I did support Basham's proposal and told him so in an email the next day. I did question the timing of trying to do it before the start of the next school year. I always thought he was set up on that deal anyway. He was fed the info that if he proposed that event when he did that the support would be there. He won because his contract was bought out which cost the County a lot of money which could have been used elsewhere.
Basham's biggest problem lay in the changing argument- first he wanted to ADD space to the schools because people were going to leave the cities after 9-11-01, then we didn't need all the space. In Jan one year, we had 54 million to "consolidate" the 6 schools into 3, but by June we had gotten to the point we needed to close Appy and buy "mobile calssrooms" to put these kids in to save 1 mil. There is still something that is funny about that funding formula.
Just thinking out loud here....
Isn't PV a consolidated school?
Why not ask the anti-consolidation crowd "What's wrong with PV? Why doesn't it work?"
Thanks...Coming from you I consider that a compliment. The "legality" issue is one of the excuses I refer to. If they wanted a vote on this it would have already been done because they would have found a way to get it on a ballot. IMO, the reason it hasn't is because the pro-consolidation group is afraid that consolidation would be shot down in a vote...and they're probably right.Quote:
Originally Posted by retiredteach
Most all, if not all, of the schools in Wise county resulted from consolidation at some point. The difference is that the schools that were put together way back when were essentially part of the same community or town. That's not the case now...they want to incorporate multiple towns who already have a school into one school...so it's a larger scale, and that's where the problems lie.Quote:
Originally Posted by VHSLhelper
If it ever came to a vote, it would be very interesting. Guess I travel in the circle of pro consolidation, but have only spoken with very few folks who are against it. I taught in Appy at the beginning of my career. Started back in 1969. Also taught in St. Paul for three years. Both communities were very good to me. I also understand why they don't want to give up their schools as that is a big identity for them. In the interest of progress, I do feel that it would be best to join them together.
I do know that the continual battling of this issue has swayed some businesses from going to other counties to locate as the condition of schools is a big issue for a company wanting to locate in a community. After all the fussing and cussing is over and done with, and it might take a few years, the majority of folks would like the new schools. These are my thoughts and I am not putting other folks down for their opinions.
i understand people who are against consolidation because of the budget shortfalls.
but, how many people are really against consolidation because of that reason??
people who are anti-consolidation because they dont want to lose their schools or their sports team are the ones that really get me.
education for our children is wwwaaayyy more important than a stupid team name or a school color
What makes it so tough now is the talk has went on for so long, nobody knows what to believe or who to believe.
Look at it this way, how many of us have gotten email forwards from good people, honest people, who thought or was made to believe that something was true.
Most people have heard too many 'reliable' sources now, and from both sides that nobody is really sure what it truth, what is lies, what is in between and there is a lot of apathy because the whole thing has dragged on so long.
It really is a tough and crappy situation, because nobody wants to be the bad guy, or risk just screwing up.
Something has to be done, but then you hear some of the members of the boards speaking, you can tell that some of them don't want to do anything or want someone else to make the decision for them. I have little doubt that most would love to put it to a public vote so they could wash their hands of it. Thankfully that doesn't happen, can you imagine the newspaper if that was to happen. Some of the folks who can't afford another dime to do to any new school, would have an unlimited budget to fill the paper with advertisements.
It's really sad. You watch meetings and hear something, and you can wait 10 minutes and hear someone totally saying something else, questioning them, giving their 'facts', and on and on it goes.
I guess I'm of the mind that if it could go to a public vote, and depending on if they really put facts out there and didn't let the 4-5 that show up at every meeting and almost quote each others comments as facts rule the land, people would actually go for it. It really depends on how much information can be provided and if they can counter the disinformation.
Is it best? Thats the magic question and unfortunately, nobody can guarantee that. The thing I think most people know is that logically it has to change. You can't justify the cost of 6 schools with the population you have. That's the bottom line. Now is putting everybody into 3 old ones, building 1, 2, 3 new ones or whatever the best option. Who knows, all that anybody who can look at it remotely objective can tell you is things can not stay the same. Yes the buildings themselves probably could have been made to last longer, and probably could still be made serviceable for a few more years, but the pure costs to operate 6 separate schools is too great now. They could have took better care of the buildings in the past, part of why they probably didn't was robbing Peter to pay Paul. They sacrificed building upkeep to keep buildings but now you're at a point where that isn't even feasible now.
There is, at least in my view, a general idea that they can make it work another year or maybe even 2. In some form, shape, way or manner, but if you don't prepare for the future at some point, it will show up and smack you upside the head. Those who work, especially you with benefits, do you have any money for retirement or do you just keep going and hope that it all works out and is fine? The system has basically done that, they haven't prepared, and now they can see whats coming at them and coming at them very quickly. Question is, figuring out how to prevent it from being a bigger disaster or culture shock that its gonna be.
Let me throw out a brand new idea (I think), based on something being done in NC.
In NC, if I got this right, a county is growing really fast. They have an old HS, a newer HS, and a being-built HS.
When BBHS is done, NHS will move in. OHS will be closed for a year to remodel and the school will move into the now-empty NHS building. A year later, the OHS kids will return to the updated OHS building, and the now-empty NHS will be a middle school.
So... could we built 1 new HS for, say, Pound and Kelly, then move PVHS to Wise for a year so the building/campus in BSG could be renovated and expanded? When done, it could house PV & Appy. (I don't know what to do about Coeburn and St. Paul, since I don't know many kids the Kelly bldg. can hold. Maybe someone can suggest something.)
Could something like this work?
More interesting thoughts. Thanks.
But what will we do with all the 1000 point basketballs? That is the greatest concern for most of the rednecks from Pound and Appy. Let's have progress and get busy building new schools. Give the stupid trophys and basketball to whoever wants them.:flagwaver:
In this country we elect one man to the highest office in the land....it's a democracy. On the list of important things we put to a vote in this country, a community voting on whether or not to consolidate their schools ranks really low on that list of importance. Sure, the people should choose their own fate. Like I said earlier, attach a true price tag for each and assign a share based on income to each taxpayer for each proposition based on those prices and let 'em choose. The people should know where their money is going and what it is going towards. The "each taxpayer can't afford it" argument is BS...cuz either way each taxpayer is going to have to afford it. That's exactly why the decision should be made by the taxpayers and not a handful of elected officials (who have a stake in their vote come election time) or the school system (who wants a pie in the sky at an unaffordable price). There are pros and cons to both sides of the argument...but the time has passed for debate and studies and all that other garbage. Each side has made their points....now it's time to let the people decide.Quote:
Originally Posted by R0cketer
Quote:
Originally Posted by sup-rbeast
So is it legal? If it violates state law then it can't happen.....I think you could have a non binding resolution to get a more true gadge of what people want to do but to me this just seems like the latest stalling tatic to put off doing anything for another year
Here is a link that MAY help with some of the Legal questions (Not had time to go over it myself at this point)
Virginia Title 22.1 — EDUCATION. - Virginia Code - Virginia Law - Virginia Statutes :: Justia
Anything they want to get a vote on, they can find a way to get it done...and now is the time for less procrastination and more action. There is nothing that says that anything can't be put on the ballot to ask the people if their will is to pursue consolidation or pursue action to renovate and keep the existing school...and there is nothing illegal about informing the voters what their cost would be for each. Those are just questions...after that at least, the county would know where the will of the people lies.
As far as the local ability to tax to operate a school division, here is the law:
� 22.1-95. Duty to levy school tax.
Each county, city and town is authorized, directed and required to raise money by a tax on all property subject to local taxation at such rate as will insure a sum which, together with other available funds, will provide that portion of the cost apportioned to such county, city or town by law for maintaining an educational program meeting the standards of quality for the several school divisions prescribed as provided by law.
(Code 1950, � 22-126.1; 1971, Ex. Sess., c. 162; 1980, c. 559.)
Looks to me like the question could be proposed as a tax question. For example, pose the question under the guise of "Would you rather pay this amount of tax and pursue consolidation, or would you rather pay this amount of tax to pursue renovation ?" That would be legit.