Just a little article on the tylenol recall...

thought it was interesting. Never thought they really helped any at all for anything besides a headache.

NEW YORK (CNNMoney.com) -- Tylenol, Motrin, Benadryl may come back to drugstores near you, but industry watchers say consumers could permanently banish them from their own medicine cabinets.

"I think those brands are in jeopardy," said branding expert Alan Siegel of branding firm Siegel & Gale.


"The definition of a 'brand' is consistency in quality, safety and efficacy," said Siegel. "Tylenol has been a household staple for years. For all these recalls to happen to a Johnson & Johnson brand is astonishing to me."

Johnson & Johnson's (JNJ, Fortune 500) drugmaking unit McNeil, which makes popular cold and pain drugs like Tylenol and Motrin, has recalled millions of children's and adult versions of those drugs over the past 10 months.

Those recalls and the closing of a McNeil factory have created a supply shortage for adult varieties of those medicines and a complete vacuum for children's over-the-counter (OTC) versions of the brands.

Siegel said Johnson & Johnson will have to try to shake off the stigma now attached to these brands. At the same time, others say the Tylenol mess has come at a very opportune time for generic rivals.

Exploiting Tylenol's vulnerability. Experts say smart retailers may have already sprung into action to capitalize quickly on a weak moment for Tylenol, Motrin and Benadryl to pump up sales of their own cheaper house brands.

"Over the last four months, there's been rather high demand from our retail clients to increase production," said Doug Boothe, CEO of Actavis Inc.(U.S.), a division of Iceland-based Actavis Group, the fourth-largest maker of private label prescription and generic drugs.

Boothe said the company has ramped up its private label drug manufacturing to five times the capacity versus earlier this year, for clients such as CVS, Walgreens and Wal-Mart (WMT, Fortune 500).

"If you walk in the analgesic aisle, one of the busiest in a drugstore, there are lots of gaps on shelves," Boothe said, referring to recalled drugs like Tylenol and Motrin. "This is not good for consumers or stores."

Those gaps are an opportunity for retailers to get their private label brands front and center with consumers and grab market share from Johnson & Johnson.

CVS spokesman Mike DeAngelis said the chain is still "experiencing shortages" of Tylenol and other branded drugs that were affected by the recalls. "We are meeting customer demand with CVS private label products," he said. "We want to encourage our customers to try our brand and stick with it."

Meanwhile, Walgreens' (WAG, Fortune 500) spokeswoman Tiffani Washington said the drugstore chain is "doing its best" to meet demand for cold and pain drugs with its private label brands.

A new Walgreens' radio ad that debuted last week pitches the seller's private label drug brands as brands " you can trust."

Washington denied that the ad is making any veiled reference to Johnson & Johnson's recalled drugs. "We are always trying to drive home this message about our brands," she said.

Still, branding experts say ads like this are not surprising.

"Retailers are capitalizing on the situation," said Robert Passikoff, branding expert with Brand Keys Consulting. "Strategically it makes good sense. When a truly competitive brand is vulnerable, it's an opportunity for rival brands to steal market share. That's what I would do."

Can Tylenol stage a comeback? Passikoff is optimistic. "Tylenol, Motrin and these other recalled drugs have a high degree of loyalty," he said. "It's six times more likely that consumers will give them benefit of doubt and buy them again."

Passikoff said he also highly doubts that retailers will completely walk away from these brands.

Others aren't so sure.

Prior to the recalls, stores' private label brands were already getting noticed and bought by more budget-conscious shoppers as the recession forced people to trade down from "branded" shampoos, detergents and other products to less-expensive store brands.

Private label over-the-counter drugs have also benefited from this trend, said Russ Meyer, chief strategy officer for Landor Associates, a brand strategy and forecasting firm.

Many consumers who already switched to a CVS or Walgreens'-branded pain or cold drug for cost reasons may now just stick with those brands, he said. "The Tylenol situation has opened the door to people asking,' Do I really need this brand?'"

Wal-Mart and McNeil declined to comment for this story. To top of page

Tylenol recalls: big opportunity for private label rivals - Aug. 6, 2010

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Originally Posted by R13

thought it was interesting. Never thought they really helped any at all for anything besides a headache.

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... fever reduction, sunburn relief, swelling from injury, arthritis, sinus pain, post-surgical pain (no, one doesn't need lortab for everything!)...

(I myself just buy the generics though. )

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Originally Posted by imported_elp6n

... Fever reduction, sunburn relief, swelling from injury, arthritis, sinus pain, post-surgical pain (no, one doesn't need lortab for everything!)...

(i myself just buy the generics though. )

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nice comment elp!!

I meant what it actually does for most people, not what it claims to do, it alone for things like "post surgical pain" is a joke for most people...though it still effects your liver as bad as anything. Acetaminophen is a good fever-reducer, it's in everyone of them though.

I should have also added to that, benedryl is in a whole other class than motrin and tylenol, being an antihistamine and not a pain reliever - it's a life saver (literally) in many cases. It does more than stop your allergy sniffles.

And all those things listed are things that they have done for me - not what they claim they can do for me
:)

That's good, I'm sure it does for others as well, but someone would have to have a low tolerance for things like that before it could. Benedryl definitely does save lives, but Tylenol and others with Acetaminophen barely work, but do a lot of damage.

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Originally Posted by R13

That's good, I'm sure it does for others as well, but someone would have to have a low tolerance for things like that before it could. Benedryl definitely does save lives, but Tylenol and others with Acetaminophen barely work, but do a lot of damage.

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Check the formula of your favorite RX pain reliever and see how many have acetaminophen. You won't find many that aren't based on the stuff. Since it has been mentioned check the Lor-tabs, most have 350 to 500 mgs.

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Originally Posted by simple man

Check the formula of your favorite RX pain reliever and see how many have acetaminophen. You won't find many that aren't based on the stuff. Since it has been mentioned check the Lor-tabs, most have 350 to 500 mgs.

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I don't take anything, I have lidoderm patches for my back, that's it. I know acetaminophen is in them, pretty sure that's the whole point I'm trying to make, that tylenol doesn't do much but damages your liver just as much.

If anyone says, and I repeat anyone on this board says they don't take tylenol or motrin in some form, I would have to call them and out-right liar. As for benedryl, it was one of the very first antihistamines on the market that has proven not only to reduce allergy attacks, but also it is very helpful in bee stings. all lidoderm does is to numb the area around the injury, mostly a topical numbing.

For you, these products may don nothing for you, but for millions and millions of people everywhere, these are wonderdrugs. I suppose you would also dispute the effectiveness of aspirin on arthritis and heart health.

No one has said that. Yeah, benedryl does, not getting who's disputing any of this. They numb the muscle in the area. Really didn't recommend it to anyone, it's up to their doctor, just using them recently for my back.

That's great for them too, it also is the leader in acute liver failure and more calls to poison control than any other drug out there. The problem is people pop the things too much, IMO as part placebo issue and thinking that it isn't harmful because it isn't a narcotic. And no, you can assume that for whatever reason, but why on earth would that be disputed? Never seen a bunch who pulls things like that out of nowhere from something I said, puzzles me every time.

Not necessarily too much, but most people have no idea how many products tylenol is in.
Lortab, percocet, darvocet, even the pain reliever they give by injection(torredol) is just a high powered motrin shot.

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Originally Posted by R13

That's great for them too, it also is the leader in acute liver failure and more calls to poison control than any other drug out there. .

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Post all the facts.
The calls are because:
1) nearly every household out there has these in their medicine cabinet
2) the calls are from misuse (purposeful and/or accidental), not from being used as directed.

And calling poison control doesn't mean someone HAS been injured by the drug, it generally means someone has taken too much or mixed it with something and they need to know what to do next.

Instances of liver failure are not from being used as directed either. It's largely from overuse and/or mixing with inappropriate substances (i.e. alcohol)

Be careful not to twist the facts or omit details.

btw - your lidoderm is more toxic in prescribed doses than tylenol in recommended doses. Are you sure you were prescribed that for your back? It's by prescription only and isn't prescribed for back pain - it's for shingles and post-shingles pain relief (surface nerve pain). That would be an off-label usage. Those things are crazy expensive too...

I have a compressed disk in my back. I take 800 mg ibuprofren (prescribed), as needed, to deal with it. The problem isn't going to go away and the ibuprofen treatment is less toxic to me than the higher-level pain killers long term.

I posted facts and didn't say that there weren't other reasons. Of course they are in most households and it's when it's overused. But I just said this...

"The problem is people pop the things too much..."

People constantly take them, because they are 1) Not that powerful and 2) because they think because it's an otc and not a narcotic, it doesn't do any damage. Esp. ff you have an existing problem with your liver or kidneys, doesn't have to be major, it won't dump it out of your system and build up.

Never said it wasn't more powerful, of course it is. Absolutely positive. That's what it is usually prescribed for and attributed to, but it's also prescribed for pain from things like fibromyalgia to p. Doctors due the "clinical trial" things for different problems all the time, even though it isn't widely prescribed for it. Just started it a few weeks ago, it works okay, I cut them in half and spread it out a bit. It's a 25 dollar co-pay, but that with primary and secondary insurance, they aren't cheap.


Well that's good, I mean if it works, that's great for anyone. I had a lot of pain medicine when I was younger, so I have a high tolerance automatically.

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Originally Posted by centennialdawg

Not necessarily too much, but most people have no idea how many products tylenol is in.
Lortab, percocet, darvocet, even the pain reliever they give by injection(torredol) is just a high powered motrin shot.

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Acetaminophen is in about every pain reliever, that's part of the problem.

The responsibility for one's health regarding OTC and prescription meds is to know what's in them and take them only as directed. Anyone that can't understand prescribing labels can walk into or call any pharmacy and get clarification.

The labels give the limits. Obey the label/prescribing directions.
This not only applies to tylenol and motrin but to anything else out there too.
Everything we put into our bodies has potential for harm.

It's up to us to know the risks and be wise, not for the government or other party to take meds (that are safe when used as directed) away from us because we might hurt ourselves with them.

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Originally Posted by R13

Acetaminophen is in about every pain reliever, that's part of the problem.

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Then why do you keep contradicting yourself? First it is because people pop them too much, now it is because it is in about every pain reliever.

We aren't really arguing the article you posted, but instead, your comments on its use/misuse.

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Originally Posted by R13

I had a lot of pain medicine when I was younger, so I have a high tolerance automatically.

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I think the summary to your argument is this:

You have a higher tolerance for pain meds, so you are now on higher level prescription painkillers to get the same relief many of us get from tylenol or motrin (understanding why, considering the medical background).

So since you personally really have no use for the stuff, you see no harm in just ditching it altogether (referring back your first sentence in this thread).

I dont have insurance that will let me run to the dr for aches pains and the other issues I listed earlier in the thread. People like me really need access to the common OTC meds.

I dont have insurance that will let me run to the dr for aches pains and the other issues I listed earlier in the thread. People like me really need access to the common OTC meds.



Thank you for saying that, My family (my husband,myself,and my son) have no insurance. It's not for the lack of looking though. My husband has diabetes and is on the insulin pump (as most of you know) and he also has Hashimoto's (SP) disease. I have a pituatary gland tumor that has to be monitored with a MRI yearly that I haven't had done in over 4 years. I have headaches almost daily if not every other day. Previously when I had insurance I was prescribed some expensive migraine medicine for them (can't remember the name). Now I continue to have the headaches and I get by with just taking Tylenol and Goody's powders. As for the insurance, hopefully soon we will be able to get some but the pre-existing condition clauses really suck and that is even if we can get insurance for the diabetes at at least a price that is not going to cost an arm and leg.. I am not to concerned with my lack of insurance but I am concerned with my husbands and son.

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Originally Posted by imported_elp6n

I think the summary to your argument is this:

You have a higher tolerance for pain meds, so you are now on higher level prescription painkillers to get the same relief many of us get from tylenol or motrin (understanding why, considering the medical background).

So since you personally really have no use for the stuff, you see no harm in just ditching it altogether (referring back your first sentence in this thread).

I dont have insurance that will let me run to the dr for aches pains and the other issues I listed earlier in the thread. People like me really need access to the common OTC meds.

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This is a good comment. I remember when they took Tylenol off the prescribed list. Or when whatever happened that made it otc. It helped folks with fevers and minor aches, hands down. But the same group that really have a problem not using too much Tylenol , would have the same problem with asprin or Lortab, if these were the common otc med. It is more of a "people problem" than a med problem, don't see any good solution.

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Originally Posted by imported_elp6n

The responsibility for one's health regarding OTC and prescription meds is to know what's in them and take them only as directed. Anyone that can't understand prescribing labels can walk into or call any pharmacy and get clarification.

The labels give the limits. Obey the label/prescribing directions.
This not only applies to tylenol and motrin but to anything else out there too.
Everything we put into our bodies has potential for harm.

It's up to us to know the risks and be wise, not for the government or other party to take meds (that are safe when used as directed) away from us because we might hurt ourselves with them.

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I don't disagree with any of this, it's absolutely right, a lot of things come personal responsibility...but people seem to struggle with it and that leads to problems.

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Originally Posted by centennialdawg

Then why do you keep contradicting yourself? First it is because people pop them too much, now it is because it is in about every pain reliever.

We aren't really arguing the article you posted, but instead, your comments on its use/misuse.

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How am I contradicting myself? I said it was part of the problem, it is. The main problem to me is them popping them too much.

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Originally Posted by imported_elp6n

I think the summary to your argument is this:

You have a higher tolerance for pain meds, so you are now on higher level prescription painkillers to get the same relief many of us get from tylenol or motrin (understanding why, considering the medical background).

So since you personally really have no use for the stuff, you see no harm in just ditching it altogether (referring back your first sentence in this thread).

I dont have insurance that will let me run to the dr for aches pains and the other issues I listed earlier in the thread. People like me really need access to the common OTC meds.

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Everyone develops a tolerance to whatever medicine if used enough, this includes Tylenol. The more it's used, the less effective it gets, the more people take to balance that out...then the problems occur and people don't even realize it.

The OP wasn't about the gov. or anyone taking anything away. It was about the legit recall on it based on consumer complaints, then businesses not taking the risk of carrying the product on its shelves. I think it's overused big time here, so a little less of it, doesn't really bother me. But I haven't condoned any taking it away from people by the gov. or anything, I use it occasionally for headaches myself like I originally said.

And no ones saying to take that away, I agree it is needed and used correctly by people like you, but it's used too much and can be really harmful...which it is ignored by many because it's OTC.

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Originally Posted by cosmo99

Thank you for saying that, My family (my husband,myself,and my son) have no insurance. It's not for the lack of looking though. My husband has diabetes and is on the insulin pump (as most of you know) and he also has Hashimoto's (SP) disease. I have a pituatary gland tumor that has to be monitored with a MRI yearly that I haven't had done in over 4 years. I have headaches almost daily if not every other day. Previously when I had insurance I was prescribed some expensive migraine medicine for them (can't remember the name). Now I continue to have the headaches and I get by with just taking Tylenol and Goody's powders. As for the insurance, hopefully soon we will be able to get some but the pre-existing condition clauses really suck and that is even if we can get insurance for the diabetes at at least a price that is not going to cost an arm and leg.. I am not to concerned with my lack of insurance but I am concerned with my husbands and son.

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A testament to why the HC reform was needed. I'm covered by my parents insurance they get from my mothers job(the VA) and stepdads(which is Alpha's), I'll be on that until I'm 26, for as long as I can - because of the new bill btw. I've not got a good medical history and at a young age, plus several conditions now that I'll always have. If I weren't on theirs, I wouldn't have coverage and I don't know how I'll have coverage then without paying an ungodly amount for it - can only hope I get decent coverage from my job at the time.

I hate it when newbies "kill" a good thread.

From the link in his sig, looks like he's a spammer, afraid to click it..probably loaded with viruses.