For Atheists, Agnostics and Non-Religious persons in general. Message me for details if interested. Thank you.
:flagwaver:
Printable View
For Atheists, Agnostics and Non-Religious persons in general. Message me for details if interested. Thank you.
:flagwaver:
Are religious people allowed to join in and discuss beliefs too or what? would be good to get all the different viewpoints together.
Just curious but do you celebrate christmas? like do you buy your children/family gifts?
The reds don't like these posts. Tread carefully.Quote:
Originally Posted by entr0py
You will need to go out-side the local area- none of us can think.Quote:
Originally Posted by entr0py
TBH with you i was being serious. i dont see why anyone would have a problem with it. I studied a lot of different beliefs and religions and i find it fascinating, dont mind hearing about the lack of beliefs and reasoning why either. for the record my best friend is an atheist and I care about him as much as any of my other friends. not all of us REDS are close minded. did you just post that to try to start crap or what?Quote:
Originally Posted by Ironlung
I laughed. : DQuote:
Originally Posted by simple man
It seems to me the moment that group meets, the become what they have difference with. The free thinking goes out the window when you start to meet.
no truer words have ever been spoken i believe. I just have to ask though, if you all are in agreeance with your beliefs what would this meeting be about? on how/why you dont believe in something or what?Quote:
Originally Posted by yankeebaseball
Sort of throws the whole idea of church right out the door then too, doesn't it?Quote:
Originally Posted by Rocky
Nope, we still believe and have faith.Quote:
Originally Posted by R13
So? Btw "faith" isn't reserved for religion, you can have faith in anything, doesn't have to be some god. I don't get why a meeting like this is any less relevant than church, it would be greatly informative and extremely supportive.Quote:
Originally Posted by centennialdawg
You can believe what you want that is your decision. We don't need your atheism shoved down our throats lol.
The same can be said for any religion, but I digress.Quote:
Originally Posted by Monkeyhead
I assuming there will be some sort of Kool-aid served at this event..... no?
Never said anything about them not having faith. Just that we still believe and have faith. But, food for thought, if this "free thought group" has faith, doesn't that defeat the purpose of being an atheist, or agnostic? I mean, if you don't have faith in God, but you do other things, as you so stated, then, aren't you losing sight of your "non-belief"? Please explain yourself on this, just so I might understand. And are you comparing this meeting to church? If so, then in a lot of people's eyes, this becomes sort of a religious thing doesn't it?Quote:
Originally Posted by R13
because free thinking is "FREE".
people go to church as a common bond, with whatever religion, whatever god, whatever denomination etc. You dont see Catholics going to Old Regular Baptist meetings.
To me an atheist and an agnostic is much along the lines of a Muslim and a Jew. (or any two religions, I chose those due to the similarity (belief in god) and the glaring difference (the god they believe in)
Those are two very different ideas, with one thing (and thats a stretch) in common. Disbelief in GOD, however an agnostic with, some ... "proof" could change their mind, whatever proof that may be, to each person that would and could be diff. An atheist just says no, thats it. Many say "organized religion" is the problem, a united atheist group is laughable to me, its like the band "the lone rangers" if you can understand what that means.
Many times people who dont believe in god are much like my beloved metal bands, in the sense "hey we dont like the rules that come with your god". I get it, but then you have people like the Norwegian bands and their beliefs. "Hey we dont want your beliefs, we had ours..."
But its whatever.
It's not "non-belief" in anything/everything, it's non-belief in religion and the existence of a God or gods. That's where you're lost in translation.Quote:
But, food for thought, if this "free thought group" has faith, doesn't that defeat the purpose of being an atheist, or agnostic? I mean, if you don't have faith in God, but you do other things, as you so stated, then, aren't you losing sight of your "non-belief"?
Not speaking for R13, but I don't compare this to church. I compare this moreso to a town hall type of meeting, a group/organization like a civic league or something before I'd compare it to church. I know this is going to sound messed up, but it takes a lot of faith to believe in nothing, sometimes more than to believe in something. I think an organization like this would help people who don't believe strengthen their non-belief, to have a common bond with someone who doesn't believe as well...so they don't feel so alone.Quote:
And are you comparing this meeting to church? If so, then in a lot of people's eyes, this becomes sort of a religious thing doesn't it?
It's easy to get instant-gratification if you believe in God or a particular religion--pick a church and go, it's there for the taking. It's a lot harder to get support and reinforcement if you don't believe in a God or gods, as there aren't a lot of formal organizations that focus on that--especially in this area.
No kool-aid, local churches go through it pretty quickly.Quote:
Originally Posted by Milk3
Like I said, faith doesn't equal God, so no having faith in something doesn't defeat the purpose. I have faith in myself, my family, my friends in different things...I can believe in myself, it doesn't have to be a God, but it's associated with god often.Quote:
Originally Posted by centennialdawg
From what you say, it seems as though you think we just don't believe in a god for just the sake of not believing in a god, we do because we don't think there is one...we believe in many things, just not a god. There was that quote "We're both the same, I just believe in one fewer God than you" and then asks why you don't believe in all of the other gods in the world, then you'll know why we don't believe in yours.
I'm not saying it is church, but it's very similar. Both are a gathering of people with common beliefs to talk about those beliefs, that's all church is, whether people believe it or not.
Some fella one time once wrote 'my own mind is my own church'
people should spend less time debating which is right, my church, your church or no church and focus more how it affects or is it effect, anyway that single person. Atheist, Hindu, Scientologist or Member of the Holy Altar of Kelly Clarkson, letting someone else sway you in your belief is a tragedy.
Good post yb. If you are in a church that is just talking about other churches, I would run fast. That is not the purpose of a church.
Glad somebody got a laugh out of it with me as well.Quote:
Originally Posted by R13
Well, God gave us free will and the freedom to choose. I have searched all religions and denominations and have found that picking the right church must be a choice of what you actually believe and which one will most closely align with your own thoughts and perceptions of what a "supreme" diety(sp) really is.Quote:
Originally Posted by yankeebaseball
If this "free thought" group wants to form, then I really see nothing wrong with it. It; however, would not fit in with my faith toward my God. That is something that will never be shaken as I am not the least bit threatened by this group's existence.
My grandfather always said, Religion and politics is something that is better left to yourself and in your mind, only to be discussed with like minded people and then, only to the point of agreement with each other because when you start to argue, you lose all perspective in either one. Let us all lead by example and not "brow-beat" each other into submission.
I dont agree at all.Quote:
Originally Posted by yankeebaseball
I dont see how atheism and Islam/Buddhism/etc... have anything in common, since one gives out specific guidelines on how to live a life, and the other has absolutely no guidelines at all.
Muslims have to pray to Mecca, Catholics have to eat crackers and wine. Atheism in itself is the complete opposite. Its not a denomination. Its the exact opposite of the denomination. Atheism is the most self-centered decision you can ever make. Its all about yourself; it has nothing to do with following cultural norms associated with atheism, its all about the individual decision not to believe in a deity.
Belief and non-belief are not the same. I dont have "faith" in atheism, thats the exact opposite meaning of atheism. Faith indicates there is something out there you have to believe without knowing, without being able to make a rational decision based on facts. and I do not believe that situation exists.
and I kinda resent the last part. Its kind of insulting to insinuate that most people who are atheists only do it because they do not like a church's rules. Myself, the decision was made on a factual, logical decision. I cant speak for anyone, and im sure there are a ton of people who are atheists just for teh sake of atheism, which is what you are describing, but not all of us are just petty kids mad because someone is trying to tell us what to do.
I chose the path I chose because it seems to me that all religions are the same, its the explanation of where we came from and what happens after we die; i believe religions are just man-made creations to try and soothe the human mind. Death is a very , very scary demon, and if theres nothing to look forward to after death, no afterlife, then death is even scarier to some. Some believe life is worthless without the afterlife, I believe the exact opposite. Life IS heaven, and death is permanent.
but I do believe in a weird spirituality, that the Earth is the center of the universe and our conscience is the soul, and that nature itself, the Earth, is the governing body of our universe.
I have absolutely NO problem with atheism or agnostics. none at all, I am HUGE on freedom of beliefs and freedom of worship. I cant tell anyone to believe the way i do and i admire anyone for keeping their stance on their religious/non religious views. I was being serious about having people with a faith join some of the discussions because i want to know why people feel so passionately AGAINST something that i believe in so passionately. EVERYONE in my family preaches (some preach just to get money from the church or steal it from their mother *who is recently deceased* or their brother who poured his heart and soul into it) but thats neither here nor there. I have 3 uncles that preach and a sleugh of great uncles. I have my reasons for my own personal beliefs and they have theirs and you have reasons for yours. I can discuss religion with anyone and it not be heated because i am open to all beliefs, i wish that you believed in God but if you dont thats your perogative. The only thing i have a problem with is when atheists/agnostics complain about Christian type people (i wont say Christians) trying to force their beliefs when you constantly hear of A&A trying to remove things we believe in or get rid of a moment of silence. Some people are pushy, i go about a less direct approach..............
The point of agnosticism/atheism has nothing to do with being "against" anything, most just see the shit religion causes and has caused since day one...also against religion being where it's not supposed to be with our gov. and schools. There's no real push for the moment of silence to be taken out by us, we're the reason there is the moment of silence actually. We're a pretty large percentage of the population, yet demonized for no reason whatsoever and forced to put up with religions like Christianity sticking their nose everywhere it shouldn't be.
ummm, you are wrong on the moment of silence thing. there is another thread about that somewhere, the american atheist group wants the moment of silence gone as well.Quote:
Originally Posted by R13
American Atheists | School Prayer FAQs
read it, i also have another question, if you want seperation of religion and politics then why do atheists put their nose everywhere too? this could go both ways man, if what you have is a claimed religion then why is it fair for you to express your opinion and make you happy but not make the christian community happy? there should be a fine line somewhere.
No I read it there and here. It doesn't say that they are trying to get it removed, like I said, there is no real push to get it taken out, from that one paragraph it just says they aren't thrilled about it...but since we're the reason there is the moment of silence, we're not all trying to get rid of it.Quote:
Originally Posted by Rocky
Do you mean when they try to make sure religion isn't where it's not supposed to be? That's not sticking their nose everywhere or forcing anything on anyone, it's not like they want things to be replaced with atheism, just that there is no one doing what they aren't supposed to. We also don't have some arrogant belief that our beliefs applies to everyone and it's what the nation was built on.Quote:
Originally Posted by Rocky
did you ever, ever just once happen to stop and think that SOME of these religious people genuinely want to spread their word so you can have a chance at going to heaven? I know not all do boy do i ever, but some people really do care about their fellow man, not everything/everyone Christian (or christian-like, i hate that word so many throw it around loosely today) has an agenda to force their religion on everyone. They just want their religion known and to spread the word of their God. What you see as "forcing a religion" on someone is just missionary to others.Quote:
Originally Posted by R13
js, but the point is that for the US to be a true democracy and a free nation, we cant give one religion special perks. as much as it pains some people( not towards you), this nation is not a Christian-nation, its a land of religious freedom, and when you start giving one religion special treatment, like letting them have influence in politics (which is rampant now, and really aggravates me), you are no longer a truly free nation, you are a very lenient Christian nation.
theres a big difference between missionary work and trying to get Christian principles or ideals into the American legislative or judicial system. im a guy that does not care in the least about people trying to convert people, thats part of their religion and should be respected. but when a group tries to use denomination-based ideals to govern the whole nation, thats when I get offended.
Not trying to sound like an ass, but I don't really care what their intention is, if it's against the law it's still against the law. They can't just trounce everyones rights just because they think they say they are worried about someone going to hell. That in itself is offensive quite a bit, the ones who think they are helping you, but do it why looking down on you and having pity just because you don't believe in a god.Quote:
Originally Posted by Rocky
ahh ive got the feeling entropy was just a troll anyway, never came back in this thread and said anything. probably just trying to start a huge ass fight. glad it didnt come to that this time though. nothing wrong with some good ol freedom of religion (or lack thereof)
I doubt he ever got any permission to post in this forum, so that would be why he wouldn't be back in this one. But he hasn't posted on the forum anywhere that I've seen, so you might be right.
ahh i think religion is about one of the few things that i can get along with anybody on, and it is probably the one that people would expect me to be the worst on seeing as how everyone in my family preaches.
I only get a long with people who have an open mind about it.
so you dont get along with yourself?Quote:
Originally Posted by R13
I've been open minded about Christianity, I was one for most of my life. I have no problem with Christians, I live with them, I'm friends with them, I date them etc. Etc. I just don't tolerate it being injected and forced on people and all the things th?t are done in the name of it masked as 'just trying to save you'. Try living as an non-believer in this country and in this area, and you'll learn a couple things about how Christian people act and how badly they treat you - not all by any means btw.
The true love of a Christian is not to "brow-beat" anyone into believing in God, but to show them the real meaning of God and his love. You did not read of Jesus brow-beating anyone into following him, but he showed them by example. The only anger he ever displayed was when he was cleansing the temple of the "money-changers" and such. All Christians are guilty of some sort of brow-beating to try and get their point across.
The motivation isn't really relevant, esp when they do it in a high and mighty manner, which most do whether they realize it or not - the whole religion does it at its core, attempting to answer everything with certainty when a lot just are beyond the ability to even answer. Christians need to realize that most who don't believe, don't because they don't 'know about God', when its usually the exact opposite and that we don't want to be 'saved' so don't push it on people and don't attempt to make them second-class citizens.