Hello guys,
Can someone post the dimension of the Altec 19 bass cab and the size of the slot opening?
thanks!
Abe
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Hello guys,
Can someone post the dimension of the Altec 19 bass cab and the size of the slot opening?
thanks!
Abe
The plans are available all over the web. The upper section is open to the lower part so the whole thing is the bass cab.
Thanks for the response. Can you kindly provide me a link? All I can find is this:
MODEL 19
No mention of cab volume and slot dimension.
Regards,
Abe
Cabinet plans
http://home.earthlink.net/~jmarkwart/id13.html
Thank you very much DNV47!
Abe
That's what we are here for right? To help each other out and exchange info and ideas.
I was thinking about the woofer volume in the Model 19 and there have been discussions about changing the tuning (port and or volume) to extend the low frequency response but in doing so you could end up with the perception of having less bass because you will have changed the frequency and possibly the amplitude of the peaks.
My guess is that Altec settled on the best "compromise" for home use and it works fine for me in my listening room with minimal bass boost under 100 HZ via a preamp control.
If you look around the Internet you'll also see speculation about "double box tuning" because the 811 horn box is opened to the woofer box increasing the volume BUT it's not a 100% opening.
Seems to me that only the designers know the real reasoning behind that.
I've owned Advents, AR 3a's and AR LST's, EV Esquires, EV Regencys, Altec Flamencos, Cello Ltd R-3's, ($$$$) Bozak Symphonies and Bozak 300's.
I've heard Quads and other electrostats plus new $50,000 speakers and the Model 19's get the most things right for me top to bottom so I'm personally not into redesigning them or over improving them with audiophile parts or ideas.
We listen to music, not instrument measurements and some forms of distortion don't sound bad.
Port dims are 2.5" x 11" and cabinet volume I think is 8.5 cu. ft.Quote:
Originally Posted by amandarae
You can sim it in LspCad, AkAbak and probably some others, but when I did it all I got was a completely insignificant blip in the 200-300 Hz BW, so assume it was a marketing decision.Quote:
Originally Posted by DNV47
GM
FWIW, I came up with ~9.427333209 ft^3 net.Quote:
Originally Posted by Altec Best
GM
IIRC I thought I said it was 9 cu.ft same as the 620 last fall and someone said it was 8.35ft^3 net. ;) That number seems more realistic to me.It has to be bigger than the 620 9.^3 net. Well anyway "my Apologies" port dims are correct though. 2.5" x 11"Quote:
Originally Posted by GM
BTW: Abe when you search for the Model 19 plans put this in the Google search box "Altec Model 19 Cabinet Plans" or just Copy & Paste this.Good Luck with your project. :2thumbsup:
Dunno, I don't read every thread and it's just what I came up with using the design drawings and Altec's published displacements of the 802, 811, 416 and a small amount for the XO.
GM
NO GM, I don't think it was you, .It was a year ago after all I have hard time remembering what I had for lunch. :D I was just qouting the dims you posted. And remember someone posted 8.35 ft^3 awhile back can't remeber who now though.:(Quote:
Originally Posted by GM
They look even bigger than that too.
Thank you very much guys!
I was asking for the dimensions and port opening to get an idea on how big the box is just in case. I listened to the 19's almost a year ago but did not bother to get the dimensions of the unit and port.
I am currently using a 612C cabs. The 612C is about 6.8 ft3 and I tried a first order XO at 1200 Hz (I tried 900, 1000, 1100, and 1400) with the 416-8B/802D/811 and sounds great to me from top to bottom, better than when I am using the N501-8 XO. The latter, gives sound as if I am in a movie theater especially in the mid bass region and I think a little too much for my 22' x 24' music room. I do not want to attenuate the 416 since I am using low power amps and sensitivity is a premium on this kind of set up thus trying to see if different XO will work. I found a literature on the net that the Altec 19 is cross at 1200 Hz. with 416-8B/811 combo, so I tried it and I am glad I did.
I will try the 511 tonight.
Thanks again Altec Best, GM, and DNV47!
Abe
You're welcome!
Hmm, 1st order XOs < four octaves away from a horn's usable lower limit is a no-no except maybe in the near-field or late night apartment apps and for sure an N501-8A designed for the 511 is causing a huge dip in the 811's response, so little wonder that the 416 is dominating the lower mids response.
GM
Hello GM,
Sorry if I was not clear in my previous post. I was using 511 horns with the N501-8A XO when the midbass becomes too much in my room. Here' what I experienced:
I use the 612C cabs, 416-8B/802-D with 8 ohm diaphragm/511 horns and the N501-8A cross over. With this set up, the midbass was too prominent. If I replaced the 511 with the 811 and use 1st order XO at 800 Hz, the problematic midbass was tamed a bit. Going back to the 511 horns, and using 1st order XO produced the same problematic result and to me it sounds like a movie theater. I stuffed the box with polyfill, pulled the cabs about 5 feet away from the front wall, to no avail.
Attenuating the 416 with 15 ohms seems to solved the problem using the Altec 501-8A XO but efficiency was being taxed for sure on the woofer that is why as much as possible, I do not want this method to be my solution because I am using low power SET amps.
The only combo that seems to work for me is when I use a 1st order XO on the 802/811 and the 416-8B.
Any suggestions what should I check if I want to use the N501-8A with the 511/802D/416-8B/612C combo?
Best regards,
Abe
Hi Amandarae !
I sent you PM without success.
The same result here - after experimenting with 511 and 811 horns 811 was installed in Altec 19 clone enclosure and using 1201 original schematics for XO. Speakers are 802 and 416 .So i can recommend to try original Altec 1201 XO.
PS . I was quite impressed by your system i see on youtube - my respect.
I have some questions regarding your system details -please let me know whey you have time to answer
Best regards,
Alex
I'd have to agree with using the Model 19 xovers with the 416B/802/811.
My listening room is half the dimensions of yours Amandarae and my 19's sound awesome to me contray to the popular belief that big speakers always need big rooms.
They are in corners NOT toed in and the wall of sound and nearfield listening makes up for not being able to blast them in a much larger room and things like classical guitar sound especially natural with the nearfield listening.
Last night I was amazed at how good the the Doors 13 LP sounded and I did crank it up because it was so enjoyable.
If you build xovers I'd try the schematic values for the inductors and the lower vales as seen in the Model 19 inductor measurement thread on this site because IMHO it's a matter of opinion as to which sound better and for what reasons.
Based on my experience, at least with the 2.7 woofer inductors, I prefer the original inductors that read lower than the schematic values (around 2.43mh) and I no longer have the urge to "improve" because there's nothing to improve.
I would also suggest you use pots for the level controls so you can find your own "sweet spots" then change to fixed resistors if you feel they are better once you have found the prefered resistances.
Thanks Alex! I will try the 1201 XO! About my system, thanks for the kind words. If you want, you can PM me so that we do not use this forum's BW. I hope I can answer your inquiry/ries.
DNV47, Thanks again! I will get the parts and post my impressions here in the future.
Regards guys!
Abe
FWIW, Jim Easleys' superb Model 19 drawings .
<> cheers
@DNV47 What is your listening room dimensions ? I have a choice between two rooms and did not decide yet where to install my Altec 19 copys - your listening experience of will be quite interesting. Thanks for sharing.
Best regards ,
Alex
Alex,
My listening room is about 11.6 X11.6 located on the second floor of a one and half story house so the second floor ceilings slope to match the roof line outside.
The speakers are in the corners about five inches from the side walls under one of the sloped ceilings and the backs of the speakers are parallel to the wall they are against.
I found that toeing them in resulted in way too much direct higher frequency info from the horns in the small room.
The room contains a small sofa opposite the speakers, curtains on a double window unit, (side by side) a rug covering 70% of the floor and misc stuff like LP's and end tables on each side of the sofa with lamps on them.
The only problem I am aware of is with source material with lots of upper midrange information at higher listening levels like Placido Domingo or Maynard Ferguson recorded a bit on the hot sizzly side.
I think there the room is just too small and too live at higher volumes yet Joan Sutherland sounds great at high levels so it's recording related too plus I am using 3-4db of treble boost at 20KHZ to compensate for the 802G falling response after around 13KHZ.
I hear no problems with the bass and I'm using about 3db of bass boost under 100HZ.
It could be that I'd like the 19's more in a larger room but they sound so good now I have no real complaints.
OK, when can I come visit? :waver:
Thanks again for your detaled description - it is quite informative and helpful. An you already answer my question regarding equalisation you are using - thanks again . What is the distance between rear side of the 19s and the front wall ? What kind of amplification and source are you using with this speakers? What are the cables - acoustic and interconnect? I am very interested in this info - thanks in advance.
Regards,
Alex
Alex,
The backs of the speakers are almost flat against the wall. The 3/4 inch baseboard is keeping them from being flat against the wall.
I prefer the sonics of tubes so I'm using a McIntosh C-22 preamp and McIntosh 225 power amp.
I really only listen to LP's and my main turntable is a Thorens TD124 Mkll table with Grado wood tonearm and Cello Chorale MC Cartridge (miyabi) into a YS Audio tube (SET) MC headamp then into the C-22.
The interconnects are DIY made with Canare microphone cable (copper) and the speaker wire is from Cello Ltd. 336 strands of copper with bundles of strands in a ropetwist configuration.
I tried an Adcom 535 MKll solid state amp with the 19's and it sounded a bit better in the mids but the bass seemed a bit shy so I may prefer the lower so called damping factor of tube amps?
My Scott 299 integrated amp sounds great with the 19's too and the bass is more punchy but the Mac stuff is more refined sounding.
Lets just say that it was many years to get here with different equipment, speakers and tweaking of parts and tubes to get the sound I like and the 19's were the finishing touch for sure because they pulled everything together.
Hi !
Sorry for nonposting for some time - i was busy with making the experiments with different room size and crossover designs - it is not finished yet but i can say that sound presentation in small room is little bit unusial for me - so i decide to move equpment in big room.May be in the future i will make same experiment once more.
Anyway thanks for the information and setup )))
With respect
Alex