Are they or aren't they?

FIRST VERSION 1950s Altec Lansing 811 horns for 802-B 802-C Vintage A-7 VOTT | eBay I don't think they are, but I could be wrong. I hope the link works, Doug

Looks like the real deal to me. But I've never seen the one piece versions in person.

+1 They are original 811's.

Wow! I've often wondered if they were ever manufactured beyond hand made prototypes! Even these look hand crafted. It will be interesting to see what they fetch.

GM

GM, any thoughts on how these were made? Lost wax sand cast maybe?

Right off the 'top of my head', I can't think of another 'easy' way to make them. Another thing I just noticed from looking at a book photo is that the horn 'fits' in the flange like the revised 811 whereas the ebay units mount on the flange like a hand made prototype might be. Ditto general finish. The pictured unit has a very smooth, cast look to it Vs looking like it was hand crafted from sheet stock.

GM

Going to be interesting to see what these go for. Don't know if they sound any better than the standard 2 piece horns, but they are a great collectors item.
An extra touch of class for the Altec fan.

Agreed. In theory, they should be better damped, ergo less/no audible bell or off axis 'ringing', especially if a true casting, with the trade-off being less off axis HF amplitude same when the welds are cut out/damped of later 811, 511 mouth deflectors.

GM

There was a pair for sale awhile back that sold for around $1G IIRC.

Nice find! I've never seen a pair of the originals before. Really interesting info in this thread about them as well. On a side note, the seller comments that they're very dusty and dirty and says that the original paint is good (underneath all the crud?). If I were selling these, I would have very carefully cleaned them up. He's probably thinking a serious buyer would want to clean them himself (or herself) which may be true. If I were buying them, I'd rather clean them myself than risk having a clueless seller take a brillo pad to them! Not that cleaning them for the auction would necessarily fetch higher bids, but it sure would make for some nicer photos and give potential buyers a much better idea of how the original paint has fared over the years. Just would have been nice to see them without the crud.....

I just looked at the seller's other items for sale. He's got some cool Western Electric and other Altec (not as rare) stuff for sale as well......

As far as I have been able to determine, these one piece cast H-811 horns were only produced for a year or less in about 1952 or '53. They replaced the earlier H-808 800Hz. eight cell multicellular horn which had been made in several versions dating back to 1937. Radial horns, an invention of RCA engineer John Volkmann, were all the rage in the early 1950s after the introduction of RCA's new radial horn designed for theatre, PA and monitoring. The radial horn combined the excellent directivity of the conical horn in the horizontal, while sacrificing directivity in the vertical but maintaining exponential loading with the heavily curved upper and lower walls. This and later 811 horns would be classed as modified radial horns due to the narrower angle of the initial throat section, which concentrated high frequencies and made for a nice looking on axis response curve. Most of the RCA horns had a narrow throat as well.

Anyway, these H-811s are quite scarce. I've never owned one, though a friend has managed to collect a half dozen.

I checked his other items for sale. There is also 811B listed. On the back of the flange is a stencil " MADE IN U.S.A.". Now i you look at the early models he has listed on the back of the flange is what looks to be the very same stencil, MADE IN U.S.A. Perhaps a very close production run between the two. Doug

Steve is pretty accurate on his dating. To back him up, take a look at the 1954 catalog at LH

Page 13, two piece horn.
http://www.hostboard.com/forums/hbmc...2011/11/29.jpg

Back cover, old one piece.

http://www.hostboard.com/forums/hbmc...2011/11/30.jpg

I had a couple pairs one not sure of date and one pair 1952. There was an overlap where both horns were available.

From what I understand the one piece resulted in a lot of rejects. It was a complicated multi-piece mold and if parts of the mold shifted the horn was ruined. The two piece used cheaper tooling and created less scrap.

FWIW the 802 originally used the same 3 bolt mount as JBL one inchers later used. When the horns, specifically the 808, went to 2 piece castings, it was changed to 2 bolt.

Here's an 801B (field core 802) see top image

http://www.hostboard.com/forums/hbmc...2011/11/31.jpg

Steve is indeed correct in his dating of these as I understand it they are 1952 and prior. This has been discussed here one other time that I am aware of when another pair came up for sale. It will be very interesting to see what they sell for as I own a pair of these except mine have been coated with sound deadening and painted therefore not original and yes they are a one piece, probably a sand cast unit. They sound very nice.