{LIS} U X-Men 30!!!!!

Sorry, X-Men Unlimited 30. I can moderate myself with the LIS, but I can't remember the name of the book I'm spoiling. Doh!

Okay, I got it. Allow me a few moments to get settled and then I'll share. I will say this though...Oh. My. God!

Prepare for major, major spoilers.

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[This message has been edited by Slartibartfast (edited January 24, 2001).]

Okay. Last chance. Go away if you don't want to know.

GO

AWAY

I mean it.

LAST


CHANCE!


Okay...


The story is called "Covenant With the Devil" by Joe Pruett and John Czop.

Kurt dreams of Petey and wakes up screaming. It's not pretty. To say he didn't take his death well is quite an understatement. He was a hissy fit at Ororo, throwing things in the kitchen, and bamfs off. He goes to Salem Center, where the sight of a street artist enrages him. He goes postal and attacks the man. He's scary. The woman with the artist starts to cry and he realizes what he did. He takes off, but Mr. Sinister is watching him in the shadows. Kurt prays and says he would have died in Peter's place. Sinister confronts him and says he can bring Peter back.

It ends with Kurt writing a letter to Ororo.

I'll tell the rest later if ya'll want. Otherwise, I won't give the rest away.

[This message has been edited by Slartibartfast (edited January 24, 2001).]

SPILL IT!!!!!!

SPOILERS!!!!
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(as if that wasn't already clear!)


Well, we asked for character development, they gave us character development. Developed him right out of the books, I'd say!

Here's what I have to say about this comic: the art was terrible, the writing was melodramatic, the "plot" was pointless (the bit with Sinister, I mean). But you know what? I LOVED IT!! Marvel has me wrapped around their damn finger when it comes to Nightcrawler.

Even if technically it wasn't a quality story, they did make Kurt interesting for the first time in ages. I mean, I have no problem being interested in religious characters. But having a religious character with perfect faith is like having two characters who are perfectly in love: it's boring. If things don't threaten that faith/love, there's no story. So I like this version of Kurt: the genuinely conflicted, close-to-despairing one. Or maybe I just like it when he looks like he needs someone to bring him home and take care of him http://www.hostboard.com/ubb/smile.gif

This story does suggest, though, that 'Crawler won't die. He'll just chill in limbo for a while (not the limbo with his girlfriend, the limbo with Dazzler and Longshot and all those other slighted X-guys).

-Rex

[This message has been edited by Rex Luscus (edited January 24, 2001).]

Come on, Slarti!!!

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~~I'll be standing in the rain with my pants on fire when it all goes wrong again~~

Ditto, Rex! Hi, ho, hi, ho...it's off to Limbo I go!

Okay...the rest:

Sinister tells him he can clone Piotr and asks Kurt if he will pay the price to get Petey back. Kurt actually thinks about it for a long moment, and says no. He destroys the vial with Petey's DNA in it and bamfs away. He writes s letter to Ororo, saying he is no good to himself or the X-Men, and he is going away.

Good news...I think the priest thing is definitly about over. Bad news, he's gone.

What was Sinister doing just chillin' in Salem Center anyway?

Poor baby, he's just pathetic in this story. You do just want to gather him up and make it all better. I don't ever want to see him drool again!

I don't ever remember him acting this way before, he's at the end of his rope.

For a few panels, he is a demon. He scares the hell out of some innocent people and is nasty to Storm. Then he is so dispairing, he doesn't get the answers he needs from God and those panels where he contemplates Sinister's offer seem to go on forever.

The art is horrid, and the plot contrived, but damn. It made me wanna cry.

Exactly what people have already said. The art was not too great, the "story" was kinda...hokey... But the point? Kurt leaving, and the way that it happened? That was great! Im glad that they finally show some real life stuff, Kurt not reacting to Peter's death would have been a tragedy...

That being said, the Kurt story was the only thing in this book worth buying it for (besides the awesome cover!)...

http://www.hostboard.com/ubb/eek.gif I'm gettin' this!

ummm...that's about all I can think of to say.


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It's all you need in souperheroes and haute cuisine:
Culinary_X

Yeah, quality aside I think this is required reading for the serious Kurt fan. But I second what Slarti said about the drool. Yikes!

-Rex

Oh mon dieu, poor Kurt!! Zhat is so depressing, not zhe plot, zhe bad art. Oh zhat makes me so sad. http://www.hostboard.com/ubb/frown.gif

O.k., and zhe plot sounds very sad. But atleast he's writting to Ororo and not Kitty. Zhere is hope for him yet! http://www.hostboard.com/ubb/smile.gif

And what's zhis? Leaving zhe priest hood?
WHO HOOO!!!!! *breaks into a happy dance*
Zhe drinks are on me!!

~ Vive la France!

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Slartibartfast:
He was a hissy fit at Ororo, throwing things in the kitchen, and bamfs off. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

What? http://www.hostboard.com/ubb/eek.gif Well I think Kurt needs to take some time off if he can't even take kitchen safety seriously. Just becuase your best friend has died, doesn't give you an excuse to disrepect the dangers that present themselves in your average house hold kitchen. I'm very upset with the boy and I think he needs a stern talking too. This is not a good example to set to young children and as a role model Kurt should know better.

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Keep It Safe In The
Kitchen!

Yup, kitchen safety is out the window. Storm tries to give him some coffee, nicely not mentioning that he drooled on the kitchen table, and he knocks it out of her hand. I think he needs a loong vacation.

Ya know what? I think he needs to take this opportunity to vacation in the lovely Shi'ar Empire with his lady love, Cerise. That'll straighten him out. http://www.hostboard.com/ubb/smile.gif

As for the end of the priest thing, I think this is it: "I need some time to think...to come to terms with the recent developments in my life--not just with Peter's death, but with the direction in which my life is heading. I'm not sure if that direction is the one I am designated to follow."

I was just thinking what this story would have been like if it was in Evolution.
Kitty: "Eww! Professor! Kurt's drooling on the table!"
NC: "I am NOT!"

Ok, stupid joke.

I thought this was good. I liked the art too. The dialog was kinda unnatural, though. You guys had me thinking he was possessed, like in that Excalibur story were some evil dude takes over Kurt's body and he goes around saying nasty things and drooling. Here he's himself, just very distraught which is understandable. It's refreshing to see him exhibit some emotion, even if it is a torrent of anguish and rage.

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It's all you need in souperheroes and haute cuisine:
Culinary_X

I just read it last night and all I can say is http://www.hostboard.com/ubb/eek.gif.Kurt really blew his top Im so glad that he came to his senses and ended his rampage.Im with Slar,I just wanted to give him a big hug.Poor Nighty.Does his leaving start hear or is he going to be in next weeks X-Men?Is Unlimited supposed to take place before or after X-Men #110?Are they going to have a funeral for Petey or are they just going to rap him up in a little story in Unlimited?I think he deserves more than that.This is sad,Peter dies and Kitty and Kurt leave the X-Men heartbroken.Its been a long time sinse I havent had a monthly dose of Nightcrawler so Im going to be going through major withdrawel. http://www.hostboard.com/ubb/frown.gif.This will probably lead into his mini.The storyline will probably be about Kurt "finding" himself.I did like the fact that this story did seem to indicate that Kurt might be in store for something big later on.Marvel better give Kurt the treatment he deserves and not have him waste away in limbo.Im glad I will have "Evolution" and Ultimate to satisfy my elf addiction.Though I would still prefur the "real" Kurt this will have to do. http://www.hostboard.com/ubb/smile.gif




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`~`~`Dragonlady`~`~`

Although I don't want Kurt to leave, maybe the hiatus will be good for his character. Hopefully he can come back with more depth of character to better storylines. In the mean time, he and Kitty can console each other. And no, I don't mean it like THAT!! (dirty little minds!) http://www.hostboard.com/ubb/wink.gif

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Drags:
The storyline will probably be about Kurt "finding" himself.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Wow! First Northstar is joining the X-Men temporarily, so Marvel might acknowledge the Gay bit, and now they're going to have Kurt "find himself." Man, Catholics are gonna have a hey-day with Marvel portraying a masturbating priest in training.

Ewww! Knighty! http://www.hostboard.com/ubb/eek.gif So, we're back to Nightcrawler's johnson again.

I agree with Drags, I bet this'll lead into his mini. Hopefully, he'll come back a better character. Ya know, with the Morrison Massacre coming up, it's probably better that he's quiting the team now. The last story in that book is the obvious set-up for the war coming with Genosha and I bet that's where Morrison's gonna start whacking mutants. The X-Men will be massacred in the war with Magneto and Kurt will safely be on the sidelines.

Except, I can't see him staying on the sidelines with all his friends in danger. Mebbe he can come back to the decimated X-Men as a team leader.

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~Award-winning designer of Norway's lovely crinkly edges.~

Hey Slar,I havent thought of that thanks for pointing that out!With Kurt off masturbating hes safe from Morrisons mutant killing rampage.I like your idea of Kurt returning to lead the X-Men.I picture Kurt returning unexpectedly during an X-Men battle while they are being slaughtered and Kurts wit,strategic mind and fighting savy saves there sorry buts and the X-Men decide that Kurt is the best mutant for the job to lead them through these difficult times.I doubt that would happen but it would be real cool if it did. http://www.hostboard.com/ubb/biggrin.gif

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`~`~`Dragonlady`~`~`

I agree with what everybody's said about #30.

Though, i'm not so sure his letter to Storm really say's he'll be leaving the priesthood.

Now, i'm wondering how Kitty's going to take this news... Remember she's still MIA.

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There's only one thing that i know how to do well,
and i've often been told that you only can do what you know how to do well
and that's be you. Be what you're like. Be like yourself.

LOL, Drags! We can dream. I think the team needs him more than they know.

Garble, it may not mean that. But I hope it does. I think it does, but then, I'm wanting it to be over, so I could read that into it.

Yeah! Kitty is losing two of her best friends at once. One more permenantly than the other, granted. But still...

SPOILERS AHEAD!!

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Kitty's leaving the team permanently in XM #110, more or less as a result of Peter's death I believe. She's the one who scatters his ashes. Granted, I got this from a post on X-Fan, but the solicitation does say at least that she leaves the team.

Who knows? Maybe she can go join Kurt and they can "find themselves" together! http://www.hostboard.com/ubb/smile.gif

I'm sad, though. The Excalibur crew has finally been expunged from the X-Men. Wasn't somebody saying that the writers back when Excalibur was cancelled were bitter that they had to fit the Excalibur characters back onto the team?

-Rex

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Slartibartfast:

The art is horrid, and the plot contrived, but damn. It made me wanna cry.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

http://www.hostboard.com/ubb/frown.gif
Exactly. Except the crying part... I was gonna do that in the car when I heard this one song.. about a guy, lost his homie. I was thinking about the comic then. If I knew the artist or song title, I'd post it.. but they never give that info when I want to know it.


danielle

Yeah that was me, Rex, and I don't have anything to back that up with. Just some fan speculation that I remember reading something like a year ago. But I think it makes sense.

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Wow! First Northstar is joining the X-Men temporarily, so Marvel might acknowledge the Gay bit, and now they're going to have Kurt "find himself." Man, Catholics are gonna have a hey-day with Marvel portraying a masturbating priest in training.

<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
lmao, The Nightcrawler LS, subtitled; "The Adventures of the Masturbating Priest in Training"


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It's all you need in souperheroes and haute cuisine:
Culinary_X

[This message has been edited by Spatula Gal (edited January 26, 2001).]

I need to go down to the comic shop and look for it.

Oh...ok...must...stop...laughing...can't...

BWAH-HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!!!

I take one day off (stupid virtual hangover) and look what happens! I *sniff* missed it! You guys are hilarious. Oh. Um, yes. The book. Well, I haven't read it. I spent yesterday checking every gas station in town looking for a copy. While I did find one place that gets Unlimited, they won't get it for another week. http://www.hostboard.com/ubb/frown.gif

Poor Deprived Fasheem http://www.hostboard.com/ubb/frown.gif

Just some random thoughts on NC/s story in Unlimited 30.

It's not entirely clear to me why he's taking Peter's death so hard. If it had happened ten years ago I wouldn't be wondering so much, because one of the things that drew me to Kurt when I was starting to read was that he was such a passionate guy. He'd get mad as hell and rant and rave, or demonstrate other emotions with just as much gusto. That's one of the things I disliked about the recent characterization. He had lost that passion. Now all of a sudden, its back with a vengeance, which I like, but the reasons for it aren't clear. That dream Kurt had looks really kinda cheerful. Petey looks happy, reunited with his little sister like that. You'd think Kurt would be consoled by such a dream.

It seems that Kurt's kinda following in Petey's footsteps in a sense. When Illyana died, Petey went bonkers and left too, although he took the more extreme route of joining Magneto's side.

Wonder who had to wipe up that drool, Storm or Gambit? Storm probably just handed him a towel and said, "Here wipe that up for me will ya?"
"Shir ting, Stormy--Sacre Bleu!"

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It's all you need in souperheroes and haute cuisine:
Culinary_X

Exactly! When I first read that I was wondering why that dream was so bad. I guess it just reminds him that Piotr is not alive with him. I took exception to that 'best friend' line too. They were close, more so in the past than recently, but I didn't think of Petey as his absolute best friend. He is close to all the remaining new X-Men and Kitty. I woud say he was equally close to Wolvie, Storm and Kitty as with Colossus. I thought Storm's reaction was typical of her and made much more sense than Kurt's hissy fit. I dunno.

He does seem to be following in Piotr's footsteps. When I first saw Sinister I thought 'uh-oh, their gonna make him turn bad and be Sinister's lackey.' Uck. That's much worse than joining Magneto, whose views actually make sense, even though his methods don't.

I bet Gambit was happy with that little clean-up job. http://www.hostboard.com/ubb/smile.gif Bust out the Lysol, Cajun. Ya know, this raises all sorts of questions about Kurt's sleeping habits. Does he drool all the time? Did Cerise and Amanda have a problem with this? I think I sure would. Nothin' like rollin' over face-first into a nice drooly pillow. Yeech. And if this isn't a common occurance, why was he drooling while he dreamt about Piotr? Talk about homo-erotic moments. Maybe that's why he's so upset...

http://www.hostboard.com/ubb/biggrin.gif
~When you're strange, faces come out of the rain
When you're strange, no one remembers your name...~

Okay...Rexie asked kinda this same thing over a Whiz World...so I'll say that same thing as over there...

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Rex Luscus:
I'm curious about something, though: why did they decide to show Kurt as the one losing his mind over Petey's death? Wasn't it Ororo who was closest to him? She used to call him 'Little Brother' and all that. Yet she was holding up just fine. Why Kurt?
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Hey Rexie! I think that the reason Ororo is fine and Kurt isn't is a buncha things smashed together. First, he was much, much closer to Moira than Storm (IMO) so hers prolly affected him quite a bit, and he kept it to himself...so that built up inside him. Then, he was just about as close to Peter as Ororo, so that would've affected him as much as she. Then, she's quite a bit stronger than him on the emotional front (also, IMO) or at least has a better facade. Plus, she's going to be the pillar for everyone else, I'm sure. If you watch someone IRL die, there's always someone who hides their own feelings to comfort everyone else...and he's in a genereally less stable part of his life..he's really at a crossroads, and he's not sure he's choosing the right way.


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--KC--


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~~I'll be standing in the rain with my pants on fire when it all goes wrong again~~

What I would LIKE to be the case is that Kurt went the priesthood route because he wanted to escape something, and became this solemn, hyperreligious guy as some kind of defense mechanism against problems he didn't want to face. In XM #99, he's talking to Peter about how he doesn't know who he is anymore, and Peter tells him to go out on his own for a while and figure things out. The next thing we know, BANG -- priest. So maybe Peter's death makes Kurt realize that he's been lying to himself about the priest thing, which puts him back in the same predicament he was in before -- except that then, he had Peter there to give him advice.

I found it odd how dispassionate Ororo was being -- but what KC said about some people reacting to grief by taking care of everyone else makes sense.

I felt like they used the "best friend" thing just to make it more dramatic, which irritated me. He's equally close to Logan and Kitty, and probably Ororo, though that hasn't really been shown for a long time. But he's probably the kind of person who thinks of ALL of his close friends as his BEST friends. Interesting that he addressed the letter to Ororo and not to Logan.

The best thing about this story for me was seeing a little life back in him again, even if it was rage and despair. He's been so damn BORING for so long! Nice to know he's still a person under all that sanctimoniousness.

-Rex

Okay...as smart as last post may have sounded, I haven't read Unlimited #30 yet...and I would really like to...anyone with a copy and some time, wouldja scan some or all of it up here for the less fortunate souls...who's 'local' comic shop is an hour and a half away?

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Knight_Crawler:
Okay...as smart as last post may have sounded, I haven't read Unlimited #30 yet...and I would really like to...anyone with a copy and some time, wouldja scan some or all of it up here for the less fortunate souls...who's 'local' comic shop is an hour and a half away?<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

I second this motion. Not mention for those of us whose 'local' comic shop is more like two to four hours away.

Yay! Drool in living color on my screen. http://www.hostboard.com/ubb/wink.gif

I thought Ororo's reaction fit in with her whole Earth-mother persona. She is attuned with nature, and death is a part of life. IMHO, I can just see her reacting that way.

Kurt's reaction may have made more sense if we knew what happened to him in that six-month gap. In the past, he's had instances like this where he's pushed to his limits and acts unexpectedly. Just never quite this dramatically. He's just more unstable now, for whatever reason. Moira, the priest thing, his mother, it would be enough to drive anybody a little batty.

I'm sure he just wrote to Storm 'cause she was in the story. He also hasn't interacted with her much recently. I'm almost glad Logan wasn't in it. I'm so sick of him, it would have just been a sales-boosting ploy. As it is, they had to stick the Cajun in. Anybody could have walked in on that situation, why Gambit? Sales, I suppose. Even for a cameo.

http://www.hostboard.com/ubb/tongue.gif
~When you're strange, faces come out of the rain
When you're strange, no one remembers your name...~

Now that I've read it, I realize I could've answered the "Why did he write it to 'Ro?" qurstion. Because she'll let him go. She let him go figure this all out on his own because she knows he needs to. If he wrote it to Logan, he'd be on his trail, bringing him back in no time, Colossus is dead, and Kitty is gone, so that leaves 'Ro...who will also no doubt keep the others from following too.

<RANT>

I have theories on why the writers are pulling Kurt off the team...From all accounts, Marvel is planning some serious trouble ahead. Heads are going to roll, and there is going to be some big time fighting, no doubt.

a)I noticed this: Kurt, Kitty and to some extent Piotr were the doves and voices of reason of the team. With them gone, the X-men are going to fight like mad dogs, especially with Rogue in charge! let's hope they do at least keep Storm...

b)There is going to be a lot of trouble, and the writers put a couple of popular characters in the fridge so they can do a nice last minute cavalery-over-the-hill rescue mission later on. Or, the other way around: the X-men have to save poor Nightie from the traditional angry crowd...The latter is likely, the deformed mutants will be in more trouble than others in case of an interracial war.

c)They are putting a traditionaly well-written character on ice because he would lose a lot of credibility in an upcoming storyline. (say, the Xxxies go on a violent muderous rampage and Nighty goes with them happily) Not likely, this one.(not like marvel to care about such things)

d)The character is put away for a while to give him an excuse to come back totally changed later on. This option is rather worrying..

e)There is simply the technical problem of having an intermediate writer. Maybe one of the upcoming writers demands this character for himself fresh and untouched. Maybe that upcoming writer is Claremont. http://www.hostboard.com/ubb/frown.gif

f)They really do have too many characters and don't know what to do with them. And, fortunately, they don't want to kill this one.

g)He will be followed out in the real world while he's gone, like Cyclops was once, after the Phoenix saga. That could actually be good, but don't count on it.

h)Of course, there is also the chance he is back in a week or so. He will certainly be back (Said so) and they are not making as much fuss about it as they do over Kitty.

The truth is probably somewhere in the middle, or else I have completely missed it. I sure hope we won't be missing Kurt for a long time http://www.hostboard.com/ubb/frown.gif Any thoughts on this?
</RANT>

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The BAMF department - hangout for the elf-obsessed. http://users.pandora.be/ellis.de.jon...nightmain.html

To me, it looks like they are sending him off so that he can return changed. Either Morrison or Casey have definite plans for him, or they're just letting him go in the event that a future writer wants to bring him back. I hear ya about that being a worrying option, but I think, in the hands of a good writer, this could actually be pretty good. They're not going to turn him into some bitter mutherf*cker like Logan. But I don't think he'll be able to stick to his Padre act anymore, either. And maybe they'll actually EXPLAIN what went down in those lost six months.

I've written a little editorial about all this for my site; I think I'm gonna do one about that fabulous cover as well. I'm also going to redesign the site from top to bottom; anyone have any ideas? Things you'd like to see? Things you think I should get rid of?

-Rex

One more thing: Spatch, I included that Excalibur page you posted a while back, but I didn't credit you in case you didn't want to be responsible for it. Let me know if you'd like to be credited for the scan.

-Rex

That's ok Rex. I won't be able to keep the thing forever, so you can have it.

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It's all you need in souperheroes and haute cuisine:
Culinary_X

Okilee Dokilee, but I'm a little scared of Marvel getting wind of this. I already have Disney mad at me as it is. I'm only going to leave this up for about a week so get it while you can.
Click here!

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It's all you need in souperheroes and haute cuisine:
Culinary_X

[This message has been edited by Spatula Gal (edited January 28, 2001).]