Trouble with bad guys

Tips on writing the bad guy mines sounds like a punk/thug I want a Darth Vader.

If you're going to write a bad guy, I think he needs a history of some sort. Like Darth Vader had 3 movies worth of junk. Also need to be scary, and that is usually like a confidence thing, maintaining control in any situation. But most important to a good villian in my opinion is that he is complimentary to the hero in a large respect, not just the run of the mill Columbian drug lord or something lame like that.

I recommend a movie like Spiderman. All the bad guys had a good side.

Sometimes you discover they go bad because a good guy f'd em over.

The best baddies have many of the same qualities as the heroes because the bad dude is merely a character whose goal is opposite to that of the hero...As much effort should be put into the villain as the hero, because this is where the major conflict is coming from.

One thing that I like about a good villain is showing their dark side. Now, by dark side I mean the "hidden" side of them. In a villain, that's the good side. For example, in DUEL (I assume you know that flick?), the super-evil truck driver stops to help jump start the school bus full of whiney children before turning his attention back to running Dennis Weaver off the road...

By doing little things like this, you make your villains much more dimensional and give them 'subtext'...

Also, a good villain has to have a thin, dark mustache with little swirly curls at the end, so that he may pull them and laugh evilly (MUHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA)at the hero/hero's love interest - whilst their shaggin'.

I was always under the impression that in Duel the truck driver went back to help the children so he could get one up on Dennis Weaver?

Erm, exactly...

Also, when we can see the dark side of ourselves in the villain that will also make him more effective...And maybe...just maybe -- in the furthest recess of our minds -- we could see ourselves doing the same extreme things if we were in that given situation...

That?s scary...Kinda...Maybe not...

(That?s enough from me - back to flaming!)

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Just think about it, the guy in Duel was quite simply crazy. I don't think that scene was in there to show he had a good side. It was in there to show he was an arse.

WTF?

Go away you fool.

I'm sorry to say but I think your view of the scene and the purpose of it being in there is f*cked up.

You should feel grateful however as I don't normally reply to idiots. [img]graemlins/thumbs_up.gif[/img]

Okay so I wanted to stay away from this thread but I'm back in a space of a few moments. Why? Because I found a review on imdb.com that puts across my opinion on this more clearly.

"He comes and knocks the bus out so that he and the car can engage in battle. It's all battle now the trucker has decided to take it to the finish."

I think that sais it all. If you still believe Spielberg put it in there to show that the trucker had a good side then maybe you should go back and watch the film again. In case you didn't figure it out the first time the truck driver is a psychopath and he for whatever reason believes that Weaver doesn't deserve to live and isn't going to let him use a schoolbus as an excuse to fall behind.

Hmmm way I see it you've got to get inside the mindof your bad guy... why is he bad? is he psychotic, is he misguided, is he trapped into acting this way, is he driven by desires, or is he so disenchanted with life that he's spiralling into a personal oblivion and taking everyone else with him. If it's horror and he's possessed you should ask... does he like being possessed and what brought him to become possessed? All these questions will provide the basis for your character and allow you to build more depth into him.

No one is evil without a reason... and some are not actually evil it's just society that see's them as such. If your characters are just being bad and destroying things or causing pain and there isn't any motivation behind them or any reason for their actions it will seem superficial... find out what is driving them... and then find out what is holding them back from it... in short any character is only interesting if they have falabilities.. and that includes evil dark emperors.

In my opinion, the worst kind of bad guy is the type that you befriend first, becomes a true friend of yours, and then you discover that their evil ways have nothing to do with how they treat you, but how they treat others.

Exactly, history.

A villian is just someone who wants something (money, power, sexual gratification, justice) and doesn't care about how their actions will affect others.

One of the best screen villians must be The Godfather, but because we see things from his POV and are allowed to identify with him, we don't consider him a villian, even after he kills his own brother. If he had a moustache..........

<font color="#a62a2a" size="1">[ September 04, 2002 08:08 PM: Message edited by: Rar ]</font>

Errr a more interesting villain is someone who needs something... and does care how his actions are effecting others.. think 'Heat'

By that defintion, one could say that villians have "addictions".

Just don't give your bad guy a german or english accent.

Or Middle Eastern, or Italian...

and definitely none of that Southern Drawl good ole boy accent.

Bad guys I liked include Antonio Banderes in Assassins last night, he was an *** , but at the end you thought he was gonna be off the hook. Had he have just walked away, I would have probably have clapped. For some reason it would have worked. He had a polite conversation with Sly, and told him he was "nervous" about meeting him. He then got ****** over and had the chance to walk away. Sly wasn't injured, neither was his girl at the end, so there was no need to fully kill Banderes. Shame he died.

Also Runaway Train (I think it's called) had a good bad guy, he was an *** all the way through, but he died voluntarily at the end, but killed the guy he hated at the same time.

Finally, a tvm had a strange bad guy in. It was about a train with a nuke on it heading for Denver, the bad guy didn't intend for it to blow up, but when it did, he was one of the millions of people who were affected, so you saw him walking around the city thinking "what the **** have I done!?". He didn't die etc, but seeing him with guilt worked really well.

Bad guys don't always need to die.

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m0ds

Independence day wreaked of something. I refused to see a movie where the city of New York is annihiliated but somehow we are supposed to cheer Wil Smith's survival after millions have died.

Hey, A bad guy (Will Smith) pulling off the role of good guy. That's slick.

Hey, I'm inspired. The ultimate bad guy. They always make it about themselves even though unbeknownst to others they have caused death and agony.

In my opinion, the Darth Vader's have become too cliched and overdone. They all come across as overly dramatic and boring. In my opinion a good bad guy should be mysterious, perhaps even intangible in a way. Although Belloq from 'Raiders of the Lost Ark' was a great bad guy. He was Indy, only more self absorbed and greedy. It presented an inner conflict within the hero because to have killed Belloq would have been much like ending his own quest and curiousity for the ark. This made the film far more interesting than 'Oh, there's the bad guy let's kick his *** .'

One of the best ways at looking at the dynamic between hero and villain is to look at some of the modern events in comics such as Batman's back being broken in 'Knightfall' or when Superman is killed by Doomsday. Even the strongest and most resourceful of heroes must face a crisis point in order to emphasise what makes them a true hero. The best villain is only as good as the opportunities and skills he is given.

Think about Unbreakable.

Elijah Price was developing his mantle by finding out who David Dunn really was.

Only once he exposed that David Dunn was super-human, he then revealed himself as "Mr.Glass".

But whilst they were bothing trying to find out who they really were, they became friends.

As its mentioned... "we seem to be linked by a curve, but sitting on opposite ends"

There are two conflits I like best:

1. Man vs. Man but both are "good", and just happen to stand in each others way.

2. Man vs Himself

I'm probably more interested in Man vs. Himself. That will always be the one we can relate to most. Throughout life, no one stands in the way of our goals more than ourselves.

Laziness.
Insecurity.
Prejudice.
Ignorance.
Greed.
Denial.
Fear...

Those are just a few examples. Who needs enemies when we have enough going against us as it is?

Bullies come and go.
Assh*le Bosses come and go.
Lovers come and go.
Ruthless, Intergalactic Leaders who turn out to be our own fathers come and go.

But we always have to deal with ourselves.

What happened to BrendaSmith?

Hmm im new here so first 'hey'

Id just like to say that i think the best kind of villain is one that we can empathise with, because we see ourselves in him, and that we cold turn out just like a bright eyed chainsaw weilding psycho.
eg a simple plan
a history of why there evil usually helps (but i think thats been mentioned)

Thats true, but as shown in all good horror films, enigma or the unknown can be the most formidable. Final Fantasy 7, if anyone plays games, was a prime example of enigmatic adversaries.