steve smith dvd

Got home from my gig to find a UPS package, it was the steve smith dvd. The bonus footage alone is worth the price of this disc, 2 hihat solos, one in the studio the other is off the cuff in the control room with Smith making comments like "are you getting this shit" all the time he is laughing.....the crap he is doing on the hat solo is so kewl.
Next bonus footage he does a whole segment on his fav Bonham grooves.
Many outtake drum solos that are very kewl.
Anyway this is just in my first 20 minutes of getting to view, I will post more as I dive further into this gem.

This blows Weckls video project out of the water. My opinion though. There is SO much on these 2 discs I still have not gotten thru it all. I managed to watch the hihat technique and bass drum technique. The bass drum talk is very thought out and camera shots are perfect. He discusses his whole approach to playing the bass drum flat footed and feathering. His technique to bass drum is very similar to Gadds.
He does drums solos on both his big kit (8,10,12,14,16 14x20 with a phantom snare) and a small jazz kit (13,16 22 I think) looks like a vintage slingerland with a 20's black beauty.

Let me prefice why I feel the Smith DVD is better than Weckls.
First the production overall is far superior over Dave's, sound and vision. 2nd is that it's 1 complete package instead of 3 separate videos.
I ma watching an exercise right where he discuses the hand foot roll around the kit, first he gives a complete exercise for doing this, then he demonstrates the concept, first in single note, then 2 note then 3 note combination.
My feeling is that Smiths ideas are much more thought out and very concise in his conveying to the viewing person. I like Weckl but at times he does not speak as well. Smith is a master and this DVD shows him at his best.

Thanks for the mini-review Randy. I just ordered mine; should be here Tuesday.

I have to agree about Weckl's videos. Though I think he has a lot to offer, the quality of the last 3 he released wasn't that great. (cheesey video effects anyone?)

His first 2 really set the standard IMHO.

I think the Hudson stuff is really the new standard as far as production. All of their videos that I've seen have been absolutely first rate when it comes to video/audio.

Thanks Randy...I'm not a big movie guy so I don't have a DVD player. Please...DETAILS!!! If I ever was to go out and purchase a player for one work, this would be it. This might not be fare, but I am intensly curious to see how it compare to Dave's trilogy.

The drum shop I teach has had them for a week and someone mentioned it to me yesterday! After checking out a bit of it, I agree wholeheartedly with Randy. It's a must for serious drummers. We have a dozen copies of it if anyone prefers to buy it from an independent drum shop.

the Drum Pad
48 W. Palatine Rd.
Palatine, IL 60067
847.934.8768

He goes ove rhand technique, foot technique, metric modulation, interdependance.
The History of US Beats is very kewl, he touches on early drum beats dating to the 1920's up to present day. Looking at swing, gospel, country RnB. The technique and foot stuff is really good.

i personally don't think the new dvd is that great. steve spends way too much time discussing hand/foot technique and over-analyzes every movement of the wrist and arm. i think dave did a better job on his "how to develop technique" video. he was clear and to the point. you don't always have to verbally discribe exactly what your hand is doing when you can clearly see it for yourself. that's sort of the point of a video. i think steve wasted a lot of tape time on that. plus after sitting through that long talk about hand technique, his own playing during the clips don't even look that great. he looks very rigid and tense. nowhere near the smooth, airy feel and look of dave, vinnie or virgil. in my opinion this dvd is definitely not a must have. although i do agree that dave has some pretty cheesy special effects, his video are much more valuble for the serious drummer. i'm selling my smith dvd on ebay today.

Anyone of you guys watched the entire DVD yet? I'd be very interested to hear/read a comment or review.
I've tried to find a review on the web, but no such luck.

Thanks

thank you...someone finally agrees that Steve Smith is WAY over rated! I saw some of the sample clips from Hudson's site and didn't think it was worth 50.00...plus 2 discs is way too long...has anyone seen the samples of John Blackwell's new dvd coming out? It's on the Hudson Music site also...doesn't look too good in my opinion...check it out and tell me what you think...

well, I got it yesterday after a long wait. (seemed like anyway)

I have NOT watched the whole thing so take this for what it's worth. (not much)

video/audio quality is very nice, though the audio is very soft.

I've watched thru "How to Practice." This is the 3rd section I believe.

I thought the hands part was very detailed and well done. I don't personally subscribe to the Gruber methods but I thought he explained his approach to hand technique very well. Much better than others I've seen. If you don't like his technique, you won't like this part no matter how well he explains it. ;-)

Foot technique was not quite as detailed, but still much moreso than other videos. I thought he did the best job on the heel toe method so if you're interested in learning that, I think you'd get a lot out of this section.

The practicing section was all philosophy. I really liked this section. A lot of good advice that you probably have figured out or heard elsewhere before, but not put together in one package.

That's it for now. I'll post more as I watch more. I'm not the biggest Steve Smith fan, I'll admit, but I have HUGE respect for him and I do think he has a lot of insight. Most of the drummers who've been around as long as Steve have a lot to say that we can learn from, even apart from their playing.

Respect your elders kids.

On John Blackwell; OK, the stick twirling is not my thing, but he does it well at least. I bet the parts where he's grooving with the band will be great. I don't have any idea how the "instruction" part will be because I don't know what he's done other than Prince, but that gig can't be easy to get so....

Derek,

Whaddya mean you don't subscribe to the Gruber philosphy, dude? You mean you don't subscribe to the idea of the sticks rebounding as opposed to you doing all the work? Why? Just wondering. It's also funny to me that this sort of drum conception is now associated with Gruber as opposed to Morello or Billy Gladstone, or anyone else who lived before him.
Steve Smith's playing DOES appear more rigid than Weckl's (to whomever said this,) but his sound seems to be just as big and full. Admittedly, I've never seen him live so maybe I'm wrong. I've come to the realization in the last few months that (despite our young desire for this,) the way someone looks playing drums has very little to do with how much work they get. Doesn't that piss you off for all the hours we spend in the mirror?

I'm not saying Gruber's stuff doesn't work, I'm just saying it's not my own preference. (it's not wrong)

Moeller is not the same thing as Fred's exactly. Freddie has added a lot of his own things to that technique.

The main thing I don't like is moving the fulcrum back to the middle finger. I just don't prefer it and I like to use my wrists a bit more anyway. I also prefer to aim for the same spot on the head/cymbal when I play it unless I'm intentionally doing otherwise. It's all preference.

It doesn't bother me at all how Smith looks when he plays. Sure, it could look a little more fluid, but nobody's perfect. :-)

I can't understand how anyone could possibly say that Steve Smith's playing is overrated!! I just saw him for the 4th time at the Montreal Drumfest and he was brilliant... a true master of the instrument. Every time that I have seen him he just gets better and better. I am also a huge Weckl fan and feel that they are both masters to learn from... any video/teaching product that these guys put out will always have some important information that we can all benefit from.

LOL! Steve, I hope you bought this shit. he breaks down the "bluzdah" lick! I just about fell off of my chair laughing. I told you he was the master abuser of that lick. (GB is a close 2nd)

Let me preface this by saying that I've been a fan of Smith's since Journey. His early DCI videos went beyond inspiring, they helped shape me as a drummer. I have seen him live several times and have most of his CD's.

I got the DVD and have watched about 90% of both discs. There's a TON of info on here that I think this upcoming generation really needs. His tour of the History of US music and drumming is priceless and he should be commended for his dedication to the craft as well as his desire to share the knowledge. Reminds me of Wynton Maralsis.

About his playing let me say this. There is something about it that bugs me and it hit me as I was watching: In the opening segment of him talking from the console room I noticed that he was obviously reading from a script he had written. It seemed very un-emotional and impersonal to me. He was just reciting basically.

He appears to play that way as well to me.

His drum solos are constructed and recited and seem to lack emotional expression. Watching the alternate takes of some of the stuff shows nothing "alternate" about them. Why? Because a lot of the stuff is pre-planned and played in the same order in the same manner. Almost like classical music. It seems he has gone SO over the top with technical analysis and relaxation that there's nothing left, literally. No emotion, no CHANCE TAKING, no ba...well you get the idea. It almost seems the REASON to play is to focus on the HOW I'm playing, not the WHAT I'm playing.
He has perfect spelling and grammar but is not telling compelling stories in my opinion.

Overall it's an amazing offering of knowledge. And yes, he does explain the BLUSH-DA (those that know, know.) I am currently trying to win the crown of "Blush-da abuse." I believe T-bo and Derek may have opinions on this.

Steve, when it comes to abusing the blushda, you're without equal! I saw Smith in clinic, and his blushda paled in comparison to yours. (I'd like to see him do the inverted double-blushda with as much fire and passion as my bro Steve-Dog.)

I have yet to see the DVD, but Steve's take on Smith seems to refelct & resemble his personality. Every time I see him (Smith) at NAMM, he just half smiles, signs the autograph, and moves on. Almost void of true expression or emotion.
A guy, maybe in his mid-40's gave him three 8x10 glossy's of shots he took and carefully crafted of Smith playing and of a shot he took with his son years earlier. An honor by my account. Steve signed each photo, didn't say a word, half baked smile, and moved on to the next fan. He is always like this, year-after-year. By contrast, Kenny Arnoff was right next to him being, well..Kenny!
Dave was known to be a bit...robotic earlier on. He seems to have loosened up.
In another drum forum (ave age maybe 24)the guys are into more popular rock music drummers and one thread was on Weckl and Smith over the new Smith DVD. They get really off at times, but several joked saying that to achieve such a degree of excellence one would have to have lived in a closet for years. Many said that being excellent is one thing, but to sacrafice many of life's other benefits was not worth it. I just dismissed this as a way to rationalize a lack of disipline and commitment. I do agree most simply cannot stick to a task over a long period of time. But, there might be some truth to their ranting...

How much is personality and how much is a shift from emotional expression to a more classical approach emphasizing the 'how' over the 'what'?

HA HA HA!!! Just done you be bussina pantaloones whilst you be a' doin it .... [img]tongue.gif[/img]

"HA HA HA!!! Just done you be bussina pantaloones whilst you be a' doin it ...."

I be a what-a what?

Agreed.....smith is no where near as fluid or natural as weckl, donati...etc. after watching some of the DVD its pretty clear now that all his playing is is perfection of the 26 rudiments. the stuff he plays is very regimental beacuase thats what it is......rudiments! weckls stuff is more modern and full of emotion and FAR more complex. smith said it himself at the beginning of the DVD.....hes a classic player.......hes like a modern louie bellson. If u listen to bellson or roach....the playing seems to be void of any emotion.....this is because its classic and lacks dynamics.........Listen to weckl and listen to how much dynamics he put into each fill.....its crazy!

however having said that he is still very musical......if any of you have the vital tech tones cd's or the GHS stuff you will know how musical he can be.........it seems tho that on the DVD he is trying a little too hard......especially on the vital information band bits...

...the way he explains his technique is not too in depth......i went to 2 of his clinics and he keeps getting asked the same questions so hopefully the DVD will clear it up.......people ask, "how du play so fast"....."how du do that double stroke roll so clean"....."how du play singles that even"........the answer is PRACTICE!!!!!!

however.....everyone is different.......how boring would it be if everone played like weckl.....and as steve holmes said.....smith must be comended on doing the history of the U.S beat thing cause not enough people know what their playing and where it came from. the DVD looks beutiful and is very informative........even if the drumming isnt as good as weckls......

He may not be as 'emotional' in his playing (i digress) as D.W, but i bet he'd burn any of u!!! Take in the knowledge, thats what he did it for.

... translation [for Steve H; it was a reply to T-Bo's last post]: "[hopefully] you won't be a' bustin' yo' pants while you be a' doin' it" [the "inverted double blushda"] [img]wink.gif[/img] [img]biggrin.gif[/img] ... [jus' plain silliness on my part....]

I don't have this DVD, but I've watched the clips available on the Hudson site, and as good as Steve is, the comment about fluidity and such is absolutely correct. I watch his performance on the Buddy Rich video every so often, and I personally HATE his left arm when he's playing. I'm not sure I've seen someone so stiff, but it can't be denied that his left hand finger technique is working. Weckl is without question a more fluid player, but the comment that if everyone sounded like him, it would be boring is RIGHT ON. In my opinion, if you want the feel, the chance taking, the balls, the technique, and to top it off, a humble attitude, then Vinnie is your man. Period. Don't get me wrong.....they're ALL great, and once you get to that level of playing, it's apples and oranges, but Colaiuta is consistently the most interesting to listen to and to see. He is without question the complete package.

Has anybody picked up;

Steve Smith Rhythmic Journey
http://www.soundsonline.com/sophtml/...tml?sku=EW-119

RHYTHMIC JOURNEY features drum loops and individual drum samples from ex-Journey drummer STEVE SMITH, recorded by Aerosmith engineer Kevin Elson at Fantasy Studios in San Francisco. As many of you are aware, Steve Smith is one of the world's most revered drummers.

A bit pricy at $90.

I was interested in seeing how Steve's drumming has evolved over the years so I put on an old Journey LP- ESCAPE. When it came out in '81, I was a kid and into solid down beats from Phil Rudd of AC/DC and didn't really like Smith's drumming all that much. I couldn't relaye to it, it was too sophisticated for me at the time.
After listening to the entire LP, this is really a rock masterpiece. Frontiers is also a masterpiece IMO.
He was so methodical is creating these drum parts and grooved well with Ross Valory on bass. These are no easy song to nail.
Escape, Keep On Runnin', Dead or Alive, and the space between Open Arms. This is killer drumming!
The fills on Mother,Father are brilliant.

Worth pulling off the shelf for a serious listen.

Pocket - those are some rock/pop GEMS! Wore out the records/tapes when they came out. Escape - killer. Frontiers - awesome. These r also 2 of my pers. favs of that genre, & of SS IN that genre.

Also check out: [Jrny] -
Departure[!], Evolution, Raised On Radio, Trial By Fire ['96 - i think this is the last 1 w/ SS], & ESP. Captured [! - live]. Steve KILLED in that band...ALL r great 'postcards' of that era....

Another band i really dug out of that era - Van Halen. 1st 6 albums; DEF. the 1st 3 - VH-1, 2, & Women & Children 1st [then - Diver Down, Fair Warning, & 1984]...Alex VH actually swung on some of those rock tunes...RAW, post-pubescent ENERGY, & a WALL of SOUND!!....

Even tho it was much more simplistic drum'g than the aforem, i also dug Boston's 1st 2 [more for their collective sound, hooks, & vox harmonies in the rock genre]....

<font color="#a62a2a" size="1">[ December 19, 2002 08:51 PM: Message edited by: FuseU1 ]</font>

Everytime some drummer honks off on Journey I ask them if they could play, Dead or Alive, off Escape and make the hits Smith did at the tempo they played it. Most guys think they can play it and it's really sloppy. I then tell them to record themselves and compare it to Smith's version. "Oh...I guess they were pretty good."

Alex VH on VH 2 was great. His sound is epic, but the grooves were thick and his energy pure R&R. His fills were very musical on the 2nd LP and interesting. He had deep pocket, allowing Eddie to flame away and Diamond Dave to blast.

Funny thing, I saw them during one of those all-day band jams at the LA Coliseum in '80 w/Cheap Trick, Aerosmith, etc.
I was a kid, but I remember Dave telling Alex to calm down after the first song when Dave went on one of his rants between tunes. Alex was playing a four stroke ruff between snare and toms repeatedly and then backed way off after Dave's comment. It was so real!

The following are the greatest concert CDs ever, not necessarily in order:

Journey Captured
Iron Maiden Live After Death
Rush Exit Stage Left

i just got the dvd a few days ago and it's friggin unbelieveable.

i could care less about the prearranged monolouges or the worked out arrangements of the solos and tunes.i'm way more interested in the raw technique and concepts of time that mr. smith utilizes.

one thing i'm noticing on alot of these threads is that while the drummers here are all very knowledgeable, and capable musicians they seem to be obsessed with putting down and critisizing many of the greatest drummers alive today.

i don't understand what good it does to diss different drummers, it doesn't get you more gigs or make you a better player, all it does is take up time and energy arguing about it.

my take on the monologues in the video is that smith wanted to be clear and precise about what hey had to say. it is very easy to drift off when talking about specific concepts, dilluting the info, i don't know smith but i suspect he is a perfectionist, and really thinks about his playing and takes it very seriously.

what's a guy to do? if he just ripped off unclear vauge ideas about what he was doing some of you guys would probably rip on him for that as well.

i think if you are going to give a history of the u.s. beat and come off as a historian of sorts you better get it right.

for me , to the bashers of mr smith, some of the footage i rememer the most is him walking down the hallway in his home studio and on the walls were about, 20 or 30 gold and platinum album plaques.

how many do you guys have?

everyone is different in personality and style of playing, i say take the good don't even mention the bad.no one is perfect at everything. there is something to learn from everyone.

chris perra

We find common ground JBault!

Captured, IMO, is the best live drum performance I've ever heard. Smith was on another planet during this tour. His tempo, feel, fills, dynamics, groove, pulse...all at peak levels. Seeing Journey as a kid was like guys seeing Ringo on the Sullavin Show in the 60's- it changed my concept of what a drummer could do.

I was saturated with pop-rock music; TOTO, Journey, Ted Nugent, Foreigner, Van Halen, Cheap Trick, Zep...when I saw Smitty solo at one of those all-day events it BLEW me away! I never heard anything like that before. He was just supposed to be a rock drummer in a pop band! I then searched everything I could find Smith on and that led me to J.L.Ponty's Enigmatic Ocean, which led me to fusion, which opened my ears to this day. It all started seeing Smith solo that day.
Telling Smith that story at NAMM during a down time with nobody else around got a big, "Oh. Thanks." Not Mr Personality- he's no Kenny Arnoff, but the boy can play! Maybe I'll tell him again in January.

BTW- Anyone got Frontiers & Beyond, the live video shot in the mid 80's? I've been looking for this...tried EBAY, Journey website...everywhere. Blockblusters used to carry it but it no longer is in their database. Willing to trade for it; CD's.

<font color="#a62a2a" size="1">[ December 20, 2002 12:14 AM: Message edited by: PocketPlayer ]</font>

My sister, who might be the biggest Journey fan alive, has it, and I believe she is sending me a copy if she ever gets her ass in gear. Me and Steve always talk about that video. I think it's more of a movie-quality documentary than a simple music video. It's amazing.

"On stage, they call Smith the animal..."

Chris my intent isn't to flame. You raised some points which are valid but you are doing no different to the others on this board with your post.

If you say you guys are putting drummers down here then, are you yourself not putting people here down with your comments? Its exactly the same, its YOUR opinion. People might not like it but, so long as there are free forums it will happen i'm afraid.

Gold discs on the wall? i never got into music for a gold disc which means what? Only something to someones ego if you view it that way.
A gold disc doesn't make you great or better..the charts are full of cack records earning gold discs even some that are but humourous Pi$$takes. i.e weird al.(I like him)

If you cant hack someones opinion(s) on a subject, then the best advice is sung on a Dione warwick song which says....."Walk on By".

Its sometimes best to let things go over your head because, We all bite at times which is easier than to say nothing. Believe me i know because, i've bitten on this! [img]smile.gif[/img]

Good post, CP. I actually agree & try to operate [most of the time-if i can help it!] within this mindframe. Healthy comparison is just that - when it's "healthy." Constructive criticism - no prob. But maliciously flamin anyn 1 of these great, hard-earned, dues-paid players is completely absurd [not that i've noticed much of it around here lately, anyway; of course, i'm not talkin abouut any1 in particular, either...]. It's best to DISCUSS what one likes or dislikes about a particular style, method, idea, whatever. The rest is like, well, what i've been startin to do around here lately - which is 'waste time.' [img]wink.gif[/img]
I dont think CP directed his comment at you personally, Me2, but "you took the bait [img]wink.gif[/img] ." But that's OK; i enjoy hear'g all the valid points about the issues at hand...
As for the gold records on the wall, u r right; it's not necessarily reflective of a good product; but in Journey's case, or ANY good band 4 that matter, it definitely doesnt qualify for the "1 hit wonder/fly by night/here 2day - gone 2morrow, latest whim-fad, crap-bin" either. & i definitely dont think its simply just an ego thing in the case of a really good song [no matter what the genre/style.] While i could sit here & somewhat justifiably flame-rant for hrs on the record-companies & the music biz in general, i prefer to look at the 'gold-rec' thing as a hard-earned accomplishment to be proud of, especially in Smith's [& others like him] case. Thank God for the guy, i say - a really good musician hired to do what he can do best, & delivering the goods....
I'd rather say [than simply to look at those gold records]: just look at the man's resume/TRACK RECORD...HE's livin the dream; WE're simply commenting on it.... [img]wink.gif[/img] - but then again [like you[Me] said, this doesn't stop each & every 1 of us from playin our own music & livin our OWN personal musical 'dream' either....
[img]wink.gif[/img]

<font color="#a62a2a" size="1">[ December 21, 2002 02:21 PM: Message edited by: FuseU1 ]</font>

...watch it - i am turning into the "Wink-Man," aka, "Instant Graemlin Man" ["IGM"]...
kinda like blushda OD'n/abuse... [img]tongue.gif[/img]

to me2.
if you read my post i stated that i did'nt understand what good it does someone to bash other people. not that everyone is stupid for having an opinion.

i think analizing and knowing the difference between one player and the next is invaluable to any musician.

i just want to ask the question how saying one guy is better than the other will benifit you.

i suppose it's like being a parent and living vicariously through your children. or my dad can beat up your dad ect. i suppose if you are into that kind of thing go for it.

but let me ask you?

are you better off for it?

does it make you a better player?

do your chops smoke because charlie watts kicks virgil donati's butt?

i think not..... to me all it does is distance yourselves from others.

the other thing is that most of the people that are being compared are very succesful at what they do.

so no matter how they play , there ability is proven to work.

that's how i try to look at things.

remember....

there is more than one way to play "mustang sally"........

i thank god for that


chris perra

well chris I can answer your question with a question:

What good does it do YOU to tell people what they should write about other people or, how they feel about them?
I guess like you say, it gets you nowhere.

So why do it? Because we can and because we do.

Chris..nowhere did I mention the word stupid in my post or refer to anyone as being.

If you had read one of my earlier posts, You would have noticed that, I have a tendency to not equate drummers as being better than each other.
I like what i like as others like what they do.

Am I better for putting others down or does it make me a better player for doing it? I try not to chris, And, no i dont see the point in it as i dont see the point in telling others because, thats pointless too.

Speaking from experience and being in your shoes, people will do what they do and continue to do it.
Its a bit like having a top for a bottle, you push it down but it comes up the other side. No matter what way you push it down, it still comes up on one side. What I came to realise chris was, Its not the people saying what they say thats the problem...its that I had the problem, with what they said.
I was making my problem their problem. which is why i said, sometimes its best to let it go over your head.

Yeah, you are right, there is more than one way to play mustang sally but, do you only want everyone to sing it in your key?
Like you say everyone has their own personality, we're only human. peace.

to me 2....

i don't sing.


to answer your question, what good does it do me to point out to people, that putting down other drummers is not productive?

ultimtely it doesn't directly do me any good.

it may help someone else from coming across as someone with a negative attitude.

if you put someone down you can alienate others.

i like exchanging ideas and supporting others, attacking someones playing causes people to form opinions about you.

it's a bad habit to get into....

i find it ludicrous to put down any of the great players, especially if i don't have any of the discography and reputations of who i'm talking about.

chris perra

While living on planet earth I've noticed that the world and people, aren't perfect or likely to be.

Logans run awaits. Adios!

Very nice chris i saw it and answered, before i got to this one.

I'm in a scene chris so i haven't got long and i'm about to get my tongue down jenny agutters throat, which is so much more exiting than your mental problems and psychosis.

Hang in there bud, theres a doc on his way. It'll be a lengthy stay in an institution but i'm sure after they've thrown away the key, we'll sleep easier knowing you're locked up and the guys can diss here too their hearts content, safe from the Internet Policemen thats trying to escape from your persona.

Ps: Don't take the blue ones. [img]wink.gif[/img]

You're not a mountie are you? (if so avoid the red ones)