since when is marriage.....

... anything people make it out to be?

i say this because i, for one, have certain
beliefs in 'marriage' that could be seen as
both cliche, traditional, and commonplace
as well as non-conventional, different,
and weird.

for example.....

i have no qualms with people that want to
sleep around and be swingers or shit like
that...

what i DO have a problem with... are those
people that bullshit themselves and bullshit
their spouses into thinking they AREN'T
doing it. why not be honest? and why not
from the beginning?

porn? who doesn't?
but what about those that bridge the two?
you know, sleep with a friend... watch
a friend take a shower, or some other
'friend' thing??

again... i have no problems with it. but
when you are bullshitting yourself... and
LYING to yourself and your spouse...
you have a problem.

while i have not reeeeeally touched on what
i think about marriage (for myself) in all
the years i've been here... i have shared
those thoughts with a few people on exactly
what i think.

i personally think its disgusting when i
see someone complaining about their marital
problems and then reverting to other forms
of 'entertainment'. this does not solve
the issue at home... remember that people.

it only gives you a temporary escape.

or does it?
if found out, it will prolly make things
worse.

i think the real question here isn't about
how you can handle your frigid sex life
within marriage... but how well you deal
with the responsibilities you signed up for.

i'm SICK of people being hypocrites....

i'm tired of people like that RUINING it
for someone like me. its because of people
like that which makes the whole process
bullshit.... and makes people afraid to
commit. well no kidding!!! you know why??


because people can't trust you enough that
you will NOT do it... that they can't get
comfortable with you at home in order to
be intimate. its a consistant problem that
will not be solved with BULLSHIT fixes
as described above.


if you have a problem at home... seek the
resolution at home... nowhere else. if the
problem cannot be solved... then you should
have either considered a more mature
relationship with which to become attached...
or learn to work it through.


FUCK THIS! FUCK YOU ALL!!!!!!!

Mariage problems, shatzy?

i wish .... [img]redface.gif[/img] [img]tongue.gif[/img]

why do you feel the need to marry? why not just live with your mate and be happy without all the hassle? have you ever had any relationship that lasted forever? most people dont, why fuck with all the paperwork & fighting over who gets what? what are the benefits of marriage? a tax break? or maybe being on someones medical insurance? you get a ring? i just dont get it.........

you cannot escape the institution of marriage
whether you have a ceremony, sign papers or
whatever. if you live with someone long enough,
the institution touches you.

i don't care about a ring. i don't care about
a tax break. i don't even really give a shit
about marriage.

what i do care about, and what this thread is
implying, is the people that make a big deal out
of marriage -- some sacred thing -- and then
fuck it off. its a contradiction.

i'm talking specifically about those that insist
that marriage is 'above it all'... and then
do stupid shit to their spouses just because
they cannot handle the fact that they will have
problems.

for me, i don't care about splitting property
and materials and whatnot. i don't care about
any of that hokey stuff. what i do care about
is the fact that should i find someone that
works well with me, and we have a connection,
to surrender to the institution out of will
as opposed to obligation.


oh... and welcome to the board [img]smile.gif[/img] [img]tongue.gif[/img]

Ha ha, take that, TG!

<font color="#a62a2a" size="1">[ April 23, 2004 09:21 AM: Message edited by: KingBean ]</font>

this isnt about me, nitwit!

Quote:

---

Originally posted by TastinGood:
Sorry. I just dont see how it could be about me.

When married, I'd not exercise the hypocrisy pointed out in the first post.

---

<font size="4" face="Tempus Sans ITC, Tahoma">psssttttt... It's called workin' out the details in advance. [img]tongue.gif[/img] [img]tongue.gif[/img] LOL

Funny this..but back in the "olden days"..marriage was a lifetime commitment..divorce was unheard of..you either worked out your problems or lived in a loveless home..or if you chose to divorce were shunned for it..divorce is commenplace now..people get married..then divorced as if they were changing their underwear..even i was guilty of "trying" marriage..and im ashamed of it..but not ashamed to admit it..i had an abusive ex..and you wonder why men do that to women..and why we let them..i should have killed him i reckon.. [img]rolleyes.gif[/img] ..then i had a cheater..did i not give him enough..was i not good enough..or did he just need more than i could offer..god only knows..Now..i decided to never take the plunge again..no point in it..live in sin..that way if it dont work..you can go.. [img]smile.gif[/img] ..hmmm..still not how my heart felt about it tho...then i met Aaron(wynter)..we have been togather for 3 years..and celebrate our one year wedding anniversay may 29th..i think i finally found something out...you both have to try..both be willing to give..both be willing to hurt sometimes..and a whole slew of other stuff i wont bore you with..you know what tho..the point im making...i met my husband on here..the net..yep..i did..i was working hard to make ends meet..my fun time..was the net..i found chat rooms!..wow..people from all over the world..who were lonely like me..bored..broke..and then there were the weirdos..ah well..life aint perfect.. [img]tongue.gif[/img] ..but i think marriages fail because its so easy to get out of them..realtionships fail because no one trys anymore..its to easy to walk off..and wait for the next victim..bottom line..laziness..end of my novel..thx.. [img]cool.gif[/img]

ooo..i meant to add something up there..aaron and i have spent a grand total of 8 hours apart in 13 months..no kidding..i work at home as most of you know..and he is still in the process of getting a green card so he cannot work yet..nor drive..so we are here in a small house..24/7..and i wouldnt trade one minute of our time togather..we argue..we have spats..but we never let the sun go down in anger..thats a practice to live by..it makes for a true caring realtionship..i guess i could say we are lucky..better yet..determined to make it...

<font color="#a62a2a" size="1">[ April 23, 2004 02:49 PM: Message edited by: Blazey ]</font>

Quote:

---

Originally posted by Blazey:
..but i think marriages fail because its so easy to get out of them..realtionships fail because no one trys anymore..its to easy to walk off..and wait for the next victim..bottom line..laziness..

---

<font size="4" face="Tempus Sans ITC, Tahoma">you got it, babe [img]graemlins/thumbs_up.gif[/img]

[img]redface.gif[/img]

[img]tongue.gif[/img] [img]cool.gif[/img]


[img]graemlins/sheep.gif[/img] & [img]graemlins/rainbow.gif[/img] ?

Wow..that was a great post, Blazey.

I cant believe you've spent only 8 hours apart!
That's pretty incredible. So...I must ask...what happened during those 8 hours?

You threw a wild party didnt you? DIDNT YOU!?!?!?!

hahahaha...noooo..he went to a gun trading show with my dad.. [img]eek.gif[/img] ..that was maybe 5 hours..the other three have been going to the driving range with my dad too..we have a golfer in the making.. [img]tongue.gif[/img]

I am serious when i say that about the time too..i dont feel as if its been that long..it seeme like he just got here yesterday..he is my best freind..my lover..pretty much my whole life..there arent too many couples nowadays that can say that....

You know..something ive been thinking on..and im gonna post it on this thread..do you think if your married..and your talking to lots of people here on the net..members of the opposite sex espicially..say talking..flirting..going on as if you werent married..is that right? Is it considered cheating to you? I talk to alot of people on here..my husband shares the same room as me most time..he can see everything i type if he chooses to read..and i can see what he says too if i wanted to..neither of us feel the need to check on each other..anyhow..im asking..if your doing things on the net as compared to real life..is it still cheating?

i say it definitely depends if your spouse knows.
when you open your life up to your spouse, and
make it so that nothing is secret (within reason)
then its a wholesome experience for you both.

however, if deceit is involved...

its a whole new can of worms

shit... here i am replying like i 'happened' upon
this thread [img]graemlins/sure.gif[/img]

what i mean is... that is EXACTLY what i was
saying in the first post.

ahhhhhhhhh..i was hoping we were on the same wavelength.. [img]tongue.gif[/img] ..That is a question ive seen debated before..but i dont remember if i ever saw it debated on here..and what better place i say! You have alot of varying personalities here..which should make for a very interesting discussion.. [img]biggrin.gif[/img]

I was married for 4 years and it was not a good marriage. Good people we both were, yes, started out for all the right reasons, just didn't stay that way. I tried to make it work with everything I was I did. I tried to talk he didn't care. We both worked and raised our son. But when it came down to what mattered, being friends, he didn't care about really knowing who I was or what made me tick. The fine details of who we were mattered. If I tried with him, he got mad. I'll never forget going to marriage counseling alone. When it was time for him to go with me, he would not go. Damn straight it takes 2 to try. I told him, flat out, if we can't talk, if we can't be friends, how can you love me, you don't know me, you don't share anything with me other then a bed, then how in the hell can we be married. Being married should emcompass everything. Being everything from bestfriends to spouse, and everything that comes with any relationship. Nurturing, care, romance and laughter. It all. You know what his response was in return. Marriage has nothing to do with being friends. Thats when I packed my bags and I left. I have never regreted doing that. He learned a valuable lesson and so did I. Marriage is nothing to take lightly. Those vows you speak you better mean and mean them with everything you are. I did. But my life has value too and I refused to stay in a hopeless, loveless and unhappy life just to appease a bunch of onlookers who think I should have stuck it out. My son deserved better, so did I and so did he. We all know that today and I and my son are happy and stand a chance at a good life. A happy life. My ex still a wreck. Its very sad. The funny thing is we are betetr friends today being apart then we ever were married. We know that it just was not a good match. I don't even want to imagine where I would be if I was still married to him. Probably dead. Not just physically. I was headed there in the worst way back then. He sees that now. We can actually sit and talk and laugh about those days a little. But he regrets not seeing then what he knows now. Its ok. Everything happens for a reson. I am glad we still talk and enjoy each others company as friends would. Its nice.

Then I had some pretty abusive relationships after that. I relized I needed to heal and build myself before adding to my structure. Today I am 10 fold who I was 10 years ago, hell 3 years ago...hell I change and get better by the day. If and when the right one for me comes along. I will add to my life not just fill a hole or a void or get married cause it fashionable. Getting divorced really killed me, cause its giving up and I don't give up. On anything. But I had to save my self from this destructive situation and my son needed do have a chance at a good life. We have that in spades now.

My view on marriage. Its seeing yourself grow old with this person. Ready and willing to do the work. Knowing when times get hard, you both have to work on it. Its being everything to each other and falling in love over and over. I have talked to people that have been marreid for 50+ years and this is always what they tell me that makes it work.

I know this had nothing to do with the topic, but felt it was relevant somehow.....

I like both posts from Blazey and Wiqued.Some valuable insight in both.

I think I learned from my first marriage that you have to have more in common then love.We loved eachother,but what we wanted to do with our lives was vastly different and thus we were unhappy together.

As for Shatzys view of hypocrites,there are crappy people all over the place,just make sure you dont marry one.

Oh...,and the girlfriend and I got things patched up.Shes a pretty neat woman [img]graemlins/heart.gif[/img]

Ain't that the truth.

When the passion fizzles and it does , there better be something else there to takes its place. Its ok to be different, but I so agree, you need to have some things in common, and simular values to sustain the long run. I think thats so true....

I remember this women said to me, about marriage.... she could really hate the sight of her husband some days, make her so mad she could spit. Then he would smile a certain way or reach for the salt and something hit her and she would fall in love again and again and she remembered why she loved him so. It was magic.

Wow.. great thread, first of all.

And as far as marriage goes.. it's a ritual for me. A point where you both decide "We want to go on together". All the other mysticism aside, that's what it boils down to.

But i still feel that marriage is overrated and that a good relationship could grow and exist for years, decades, without marriage. But i don't have any experience in that field, so it's just an opinion.

it could be about you......

but it could also be about Kingbean!

no. it couldn't be.

it would be about my cats before it could be
relational to kn.......


....now back to you....

Sorry. I just dont see how it could be about me.

When married, I'd not exercise the hypocrisy pointed out in the first post.

wm touched on some very heavy, very real issues
that happen all the time. attending marriage
counselling alone is absurd. you had every right
to pack your shit.

wm is also right in that the 'passion' will fade...
and you DO have to be friends...

if you cannot approach your spouse about ANYTHING...
you shouldn't be married.

I guess as a man I felt like I had to be perfect for my wife,and I wasnt.I think a lot of men go through there twenties restless.A man in his twenties is trying to figure out where he stands in society.How much money and power will i have?,whats important to me in life?,things like that.And the worst thing a guy can do during this time is get married and take on responsibility of wife and possibly kids.Some guys get it figured out early.Some,like me,it takes longer.

I think it used to be that a woman would stay around through this period to see how her man was going to turn out.It doesnt seem that way anymore.Most of the couples I know that get divorced is because the woman isnt happy,her man didnt turn out to be the money maker or the solver of all her problems or the person she hoped he would be.

I know a woman cant stay in abusive relationships,and or drug/alcohol problem relationships.You cant wait around for a guy to fix that.

I just cringe when anyone younger then 25 gets married.

Exactly.... I don't feel my choice was wrong at all.... he was an excellent provider....I wanted for nothing..... money had that..nice house.....I wanted to spend 400.00 a stupid house bobble I did.... he felt being a good provider was all there was too it...Insisted on nothing more.... Its more.... a lot more..... But you can NOT do it alone and wait 20 yrs for them to go... Oh ok I am ready now.... when you get married you BOTH have to work on it.... why should to women be the one to wait it out while he figures it out.... at least if there is more then the passion hanging around, friendship between the crack and an underlinging common place between them...they will get thru those hard times..... does that make sense....

This is not 1940 anymore...values have changed, times have changed, people have changed, men and women together have changed, thier wants have changed, we need to change with it too..move into the future and not keep longing for the past....yes past values seemed more stable and solid.... but people also lived thier lives with emptiness.... living only to see the length and never the width...its no longer the case...we found out souls and are spirits and damn it we are gonna feed them.... I see nothng wrong with that.... BUT the problem in the meantime is the transition...we all as a human race are gonna blunder til we get it right..... while we are doing that..the sad part is people do the drive thru marriage and kids...and the drive thru divorce just as fast.... I agree marriage needs to be taken much more serious when entering that institution.... I had once thought... much like when you gonna get baptized, you have to take several classes to do so.... to enter marriage, before a certain age, you do much of the same... just a thought....like say 35... if you haven't understood the importance of value of it by then...you probably never will...

So anyhow.... like I said for me and only me.... I am glad I did not stick around for the last 11 yrs to see how he turned out.... cause right now.... I would be a hollow shell of nothing... and he still plattoed where he is.... but I see value in what your saying and it does make me think....

Not thread related but....
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<font size="6">***Hugs Mystyx [img]wink.gif[/img] ***</font>

Nice to see ya young lady [img]biggrin.gif[/img]

most of us are learning that the hard way, dr. trampis

Awwwwww what a doll.... *hugs you back* [img]graemlins/kiss.gif[/img]

... hmm thought about it some and I think it has a lot to do with the ME Generation. What can you do for me, what can you give me, provide for me, do to make me happy, etc... When 90% of the time they dont think that they are getting that ME part filled up they never stop once to think .. hmm what could I give to this relationship to make it better. Instead they just start looking elsewhere for what they arent getting at home. Attention, sex, money, a life, what ever fills those catagories.


Also some times because of the nature of people and who we grew up with as parents having a lot to do with who we pick as a spose many times we often seek or end up with that person we think we can "fix" or make better somehow. And down the road we have and then feel useless as there is nothing left to fix except ourselves and heaven forbid we try an do that. Or maybe we dont end up fixing them and end up resenting them for being "just like our parents were".