PV

As far a Zero deaths here are some stats for "Drugged Driving"

Link 1

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Drugged Driving:

Marijuana affects many skills required for safe driving: alertness, the ability to concentrate, coordination, and reaction time.vii
These effects can last up to 24 hours after smoking marijuana.7
Marijuana use can make it difficult to judge distances and react to signals and sounds on the road.7
In addition to alcohol, drugs cause a serious highway safety problem. Drugs are estimated to be used by approximately 10-22% of drivers involved in crashes, often in combination with alcohol.viii
In an ongoing study of non-fatally injured drivers, 23.5% of those drivers under 21 tested positive for drugs other than alcohol.8
For fatally injured drivers, marijuana had the highest percentages testing positive with a mean of 14%.ix </div></div>

Link 2

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Drug-Related Crash Deaths Are a Major New Mexico Problem For 1995-1999, 276 persons died in New
Mexico crashes where one or more drivers, pedestrians, or bicyclists was reported as testing positive for one
or more drugs other than alcohol, according to the Fatality Analysis Reporting System [FARS] 1 of the
National Highway Traffic Safety Administration [NHTSA].
Many innocent persons were killed by drugged drivers in New Mexico For 1995-1999, 75 of these
persons were not themselves reported as drivers positive for drugs but were killed in crashes involving other
persons who were. The other 201 persons who died were drivers or non-occupants reported as themselves
testing positive for drugs. 1
Many young people were killed by drug-related crashes in New Mexico Eight of the 276 persons killed
were children age 0-12, 36 were teenagers age 13-19, and 67 were young adults 20-29.1 That's nearly one
teen drug-related crash death for every four alcohol-related teen crash deaths in the period, and nearly one
young adult drug-related crash death for every four alcohol-related young adult crash deaths.
Many drugs were involved in New Mexico drug-related crashes 222 drivers or
nonoccupants reported as testing positive for drugs other than alcohol were
involved in these 276 deaths in fatal crashes. Among those 222 individuals, 91
tested positive for stimulants including cocaine, 74 tested positive for marijuana,
37 for narcotics, 33 for depressants, and 18 for other or unspecified drugs.1 Some
were positive for more than one drug.
Many of the drug-impaired persons were also alcohol-impaired Among the 222 drivers and
nonoccupants reported as positive for drugs other than alcohol, eight were not tested for alcohol, 92 were
tested and found not to have alcohol present, and 122 were tested and found positive for both drugs and
alcohol. Drivers under the influence of both alcohol and other drugs are much more dangerous to others and
themselves than drivers on either one alone2. Among the 122 individuals found positive for both drugs and
alcohol, 109 were at a BAC of 0.08 or higher, and 13 were at a BAC below .08. 1
These counts are high and yet understate the problem State drug testing for crashes throughout the study
period included marijuana testing only for most drivers who died. Before 1994 a special state project also
tested for marijuana involvement in drivers who survived fatal crashes where drug impairment was suspected
by law enforcement, reporting marijuana involvement in drivers in New Mexico fatal crashes more than
twice as often as in current processes. In 1993 with the enhanced testing process, marijuana was detected in
62% of drivers and non-occupants testing positive for drugs, versus 29% since, for 1995-19991. If the testing
had continued to allow detection (and prosecution) of these drug-impaired individuals, and presuming that
same 62% level in subsequent years, an estimated 389 drivers in fatal crashes would have been detected as
drug impaired, and 484 deaths would have been identified as drug-related (rather than the 276 that were
identified). The Johnson administration's decisions not to invest some of its increased federal or state drug
abuse or traffic safety program funds to reinstate marijuana this testing for surviving drivers has let
marijuana involvement in on the order of 108 crash fatalities slip through the cracks undetected.
Testing needs to be improved, so trends can be judged. The State Scientific Laboratory needs more
resources and staff to assess with New Mexico's drug-related crash problems so that a strong, stable testing
program will allow assessment of trends from year to year. The Johnson Administration let "drug
recognition training" programs languish from 1996-2000, so that the number of police officers trained to deal
with drug-impaired drivers fell from 35 in 1996 to 21 by 20003, when it finally sponsored a significant
training effort. In the absence of state investment in stronger and more stable testing efforts, the best
judgment that can be made from available data is that drug-related crash deaths in New Mexico occur at a
Produced by the DWI Resource Center, http://www.dwiresourcecenter.org, 25 February 2001
high level and have not been improving. Over 2,000 drivers and nonoccupants
in 1995-1999 NM fatal crashes -- 64% of the total -- were
not tested for drugs1. Driver testing for drugs in non-fatal crashes in
New Mexico is even more rare and inconsistent, but the Center
estimates -- based on proportions shown above -- that on the order of
1,800 persons suffer non-fatal injuries in drug-related crashes each
year in New Mexico, including on the order of 450 that result in
permanent disability.4 Based on state DWI cost estimates8 the Center
estimates proportionate annual economic loss of $171 million from
NM crashes involving drugs other than alcohol, or $397 million when
also including crashes that involve both alcohol and other drugs.
Governor Johnson's Drug Program Would Increase Drug Crash Deaths Governor Johnson's campaign
to promote legalizating medical marijuana and minimal penalties for all marijuana use will produce increased
incidence of marijuana-related drug-related crash deaths and injuries, according to Center estimates. A
number of studies showed that ending prohibition for under-21 alcohol consumption reduced alcohol-related
fatalities among those drivers by on the order of 28%5, and extensive studies of alcohol-related crime and
health data showed a 30%-50% reduction in alcohol-related mortality with the enactment of alcohol
prohibition in 19196,7. Presuming the conservative 30% increase figure from ending prohibition, the drugrelated
death and injury drug counts above, and the 60% prevalence of marijuana in New Mexico drugpositive
drivers, the Center estimates 300 additional marijuana-related crash non-fatal injuries annually from
the proposals, eighty more permanent disabilities, and 17 more drug-related crash deaths annually in the
state. The economic cost to New Mexico government and society for those crashes would be on the order of
$74 million annually, based on proportionate economic loss calculations for this increase over current DWI
levels.8 This estimate, for the cost of the Governor's proposals for marijuana crashes alone, more than
exceeds the estimated $43 million annual state cost for enforcing all drug laws recently produced by UNM9
under sponsorship of the private foundation that also sponsors the Governor's crusade.
1 Fatality Analysis Reporting System, National Highway Traffic Safety Administration, September 20000, analyzed by software
programs prepared by the DWI Resource Center. FARS data on drug presence in New Mexico drivers is entered into FARS by New
Mexico Highway and Transportation Department staff drawing upon forensic toxicology and other drug analyses for each crash from
the New Mexico Scientific Laboratory Division, the New Mexico Office of the Medical Investigator, and law enforcement agencies.
2 See for example Low Doses of Marijuana and Alcohol Severely Impair Driving When Taken Together Ramaekers J.G., Lamers
C.T.J., Robbe H.W.J., O'Hanlon J.F. Proceedings of the 15th International Conference on Alcohol, Drugs and Traffic Safety T2000,
Stockholm Sweden, May 2000
3 New Mexico Highway Safety and Performance Plan 2001-2005, NM State Highway and Transportation Department, September
2000, pp. 53-54.
4 Based on applying the ratio of estimated drug-related fatalities to reported total alcohol-related fatalities in the state for 1995-1999
to the reported count of alcohol-related non-fatal injuries or the state, using NM State Highway and Transportation Department
counts. Permanent disabilities are estimated from the NHTSA estimate of five permanent disabilities for each death in crashes.
5 Underage Drinking Safety Facts, Insurance Institute for Highway Safety, December 2000.
6 Temperance and Prohibition in America: A Historical Overview. Aaron, P., and Musto, D., 1981, in M. Moore and D. Gerstein
(eds.), Alcohol and Public Policy: Beyond the Shadow of Prohibition, Washington DC, National Academy Press, pp. 127-181
7 Confronting Drunk Driving: Social Policy for Saving Lives, H. Laurence Ross, Yale University Press, 1992, pp. 80-87
8 Driving While Impaired New Mexico 1998, Division of Government Research, University of New Mexico, p. 3 </div></div>

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body"> what if its not marijuana that is the gateway, what if its the change in mood thats the gateway?

so, people who drink alcohol are more likely to do drugs than people who have never drank alcohol, right?</div></div>

Actualy one of the threads I read stated something simular.

i.e more smokers will try a Drink, and more Drinkers will try MJ

SO the answer is that yes it is quite possable that cigerats COULD be the 1st Gateway drug but since they are leagle what are you going to do?

Two big things that got to me was the Twin study (to me that is a big one) the second is common sence with MJ being a illeagle Drug it will put folks that while under normal cirmstances would not try anything stronger into closser proxcimity of other Drug users that can suck them in (MJ will affet you judgement)

Now it is fair to say that leaglizing MJ would solve that to a point but I am not sure that in itself should be reason enough to leagleize it

First off people arguing with Biggin on this are fighting a losing battle. Second, I got to say Biggin you really should look into going to schools and talking to kids. Your close to their age and you might be the one person that gets through.

the legalizing marijuana issue is not a big issue to me, i dont care if its legal or not, people are still gonna get high.

the only point in that is the hypocracy of the government in the area of mood enhancement. alcohol, as has been proved over and over again, is completely legal.

kids never truly learn all the reprecussions of drugs until they get involved, and get into trouble, thast the only true way to teach kids how bad the junk is.

Biggin = Joe Rogan.

No. Biggin' = Doug Stanhope. [img]/LDPforum/ubbthreads/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/smile.gif[/img]

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Ironlung</div><div class="ubbcode-body">No. Biggin' = Doug Stanhope. [img]/LDPforum/ubbthreads/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/smile.gif[/img]</div></div>

Same difference... [img]/LDPforum/ubbthreads/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/grin.gif[/img]

hey now, id prefer biggin=tim leary or biggin=ghandi or biggin=the bear

joe rogan can kick some ass tho, hes always on the ufc stuff.

my lip gloss is poppin!