Is it just me?

**sunhawk** · March 1st, 2005, 06:46 AM

yer welcome [img]smile.gif[/img]

ah good to see my memory isn't completely crap LOL But i understand the distinction you are making.

**sharonlk** · March 1st, 2005, 09:16 AM

Originally posted by Laurina:
<blockquote>quote:<hr />Well, this cloud that looks like a bunny says hoorah to you two as moderators because you're bloody good at it!

Awww thanks Sharon [img]redface.gif[/img] That's really nice of you to say.

I think understanding is a 2 way street. For every person who wants to share that they aren't happy with something that was said or done, there are going to be people who are happy; and both sides have to understand one another. People don't have to agree, but it would be nice to see some more understanding.

All I am really saying is that it would be good to see more acceptance that every type of fan is welcome and just because people don't agree does not mean they can't speak out in regards to how they feel.

Honestly... this whole thing has tired me to the point of where I am miserable and feeling like I just don't give a f*** any longer. Sad when that happens because I used to get such joy from this fanbase.

[ February 28, 2005 06:03 PM: Message edited by: Laurina ]<hr /></blockquote>I feel both mods are fair and willing to let a discussion run to its natural conclusion, despite whether the topic hits contraversy or not, and to my mind you don't tend to INTERFERE in a situation either unless it is entirely necessary...yes, you lend your opinions to any discussion you're interested in, and yet I don't feel like we're being judged by you just because you're in a position of moderator. I'm grateful for that (I think that is also very true of this place too).

And I think Laurie will understand the reasons why right now I feel terribly jaded and fed-up too. But I do get where you're coming from, that all fans should be able to enjoy their fandom on whatever level they choose, because we are all different. I also believe that if you question something it's not necessarily because you don't have faith in something, it's just that sometimes you need to ask your questions in order to see a way through. I know that I've certainly done that now, and I have to say that as much as I am despondent in some ways, I only have to stick a song like Affirmation or C&B, Insatiable or Darkness onto my CD player to know what it is all about for me. Not what others may or may not perceive me to be, but the person I know I am. The music is magic, my memories are magic, and I'm very happy that I've managed to find some great people along the way.
[img]smile.gif[/img] I'd also like to apologise if anything I have ever said has been too forthright or has offended anyone just because I believe in the music, and yes the man, still. It was never my intention.

Sharon

[ March 01, 2005 05:23 AM: Message edited by: sharonlk ]

**twizzle** · March 1st, 2005, 03:22 PM

I'd just like to say that I was guilty of giving Dyan a pretty hard time when she was a mod and that's probably down to the points that she herself raised. I guess we just clashed...

In my honest opinion, there have only ever been 2 really effective and objective mods on the Sony bbs and those are the 2 that we have at present. That's not meant to be a suck-up in any way but that's geuninely how I feel. In my book, Carla was extremely overrated and Ema completely ineffectual. I won't bother to comment re what I thought about maggz's modding skills, suffice to say that I wasn't very impressed.

**mlue** · March 1st, 2005, 04:01 PM

"The whole vibe from the PTB etc etc after the breakup was if you werent 100% supportive of Darren and his actions there was somehow something wrong with you. Many other fans seem to help perpetuate this as well. Many were great about it all too and for those fans I do thank them."

Interesting that was how you saw things.

I guess I would have said that was the vibe from a contingent of fans but I wouldn't have said it was the vibe of the ptb (and I hate that term too). My memory of those days was a message from Darren with his side of the story. I would have said the vibe from the message from Darren, from Leonie and from Carla was more of a plea for understanding, for peace in a very riled up board...some being pissed at Darren and some being pissed at other fans.

But I am a lot like Laurie in my viewpoint...I think most of the vibe of every place comes from the fans and very little actually comes from Darren and company.

**sunhawk** · March 1st, 2005, 04:51 PM

Awwww thank you Sharon [img]redface.gif[/img] heh heh. I'm glad to hear we pass muster because i trust you lot to call us on it if we start going mad with power [img]wink.gif[/img]

I agree Laurie that there is nothing wrong with believing yourself that everything Darren does is good, or supporting him %100 (i might argue that's not realistic but whatever floats yer boat LOL) or being positive yourself all the time. This is the collective you/yourself incidently *chuckle* We just have to make sure don't make the jump from "i feel this way" to "people should feel this way" or "only fans feel this way" heh heh As you said, acceptance is the key. Diversity is the spice of life [img]wink.gif[/img]

I agree that Dyan's dismissal was cold and remains cold, unfair to her in context of all the work she did and it was a sharp wakeup call at the time as to how little we can really matter when Sony/Darren's group/whoever decides it's nessesary to be expedient. It doesn't mean we are always or normally viewed that superficially but it is disturbing to know that they have no qualms about demoting someone without proper explanation or concern over the community reaction to such quick actions. None of us probably enjoy being reminded that, in many ways, at the end of the day we are just numbers to be shuffled around, we are a demographic to be appeased as long as we keep shelling out money. Dehumanizing, whee!

Dyan, maybe you weren't the best moderator but at least you were out there trying, even with that heavy target on your back which you were aware of with every move you made. It was very brave of you! *comfs* You were very dedicated in trying to solve problems, i remember you talking to other moderators, trying to figure out solutions to problems of the day. And you did do some very smart things, to counter the thought that you only made mistakes, for instance you did some excellent groundwork for the fic board when it was still around and it really came in handy later on when Laurie and i needed to assert the rules in regards to story ratings and appropriateness for the board.

And the lovely thing about hindsight is that it is ever-perfect but never there when we need it. I think context of the board mentality at the time and your history make it seem not so crazy that you were made mod; you had a long history of strong, often unwavering support of Darren and i think that if you had kept up that up the same, the higher powers probably (just a guess) would have turned a deaf ear to complaints about your more controversial posts.

I mean, i know at the FC board, i've heard about various people complaining to the fanclub itself about one or two of the moderators there and some of the actions carried out there were just the same if not more so in the vein of controversial and outspoken. You do have a point that maybe the not meeting you IRL (i thought you had been to a meet'n'greet in the SG days, during the Affa tour?) is what makes the difference and i think you are right that it was your public musings about Spin and such that is what seperates you and why some mods still have positions while you don't *chuckle*

But seriously, how could you have known they were watching or someone was reporting to them and they listened? We have always operated under the idea that no one cares about us on the Sony boards, certainly my inability to get a response from ANYONE lends belief to that idea. Darren himself told us that the boards were ours and we could do what we like as long as we didn't break the rules. You didn't break any rules that we had then or have now, so don't beat yourself up over not being able to be a mindreader or a psychic *huggles*

holy crap this is a long post LOL

**sunhawk** · March 1st, 2005, 05:07 PM

Originally posted by sharonlk:
I feel both mods are fair and willing to let a discussion run to its natural conclusion, despite whether the topic hits contraversy or not, and to my mind you don't tend to INTERFERE in a situation either unless it is entirely necessary...yes, you lend your opinions to any discussion you're interested in, and yet I don't feel like we're being judged by you just because you're in a position of moderator. I'm grateful for that (I think that is also very true of this place too).

[img]smile.gif[/img] I'd also like to apologise if anything I have ever said has been too forthright or has offended anyone just because I believe in the music, and yes the man, still. It was never my intention.

Sharon

[ March 01, 2005 05:23 AM: Message edited by: sharonlk ][/QB]

That is indeed what Laurie and i strive to do, we really prefer to let people sort themselves out rather than try to play babysitter. Generally i have pretty good faith in the maturity of people so i only get involved if a situation is dragging on or escalating into nastiness. It's also reassuring to hear that when i give my opinions on a subject, it doesn't come across as a "the moderator has spoken" kinda tone because i do enjoy intellectual discussions and it often has nothing to do with the fact i am a moderator lol

you've never offended me with anything you've posted Sharon ^_^

**xNicx** · March 1st, 2005, 06:44 PM

In retrospect... maybe Darren&Co were too involved... but at the time we all knew that and we all loved it.
It isn't true that we didn't know we were being watched. We all knew... certainly Dyan and myself did.
By the time Dyan was made mod things had already changed for the worse so it's probably not a good idea to compare what happened before then to that particular time.
I just think that we really musn't forget the reason we stuck with the community for so long... Darren and Leo were very present and that's what kept everything relatively positive back then. People were watching what they said because they knew *someone* important was looking over their shoulders. I also seem to remember that Dyan once mentioned in a post how Carla had to send certain threads on to Sony.
The "positive" attitude existed then, too - except I don't think many people questioned it because Darren (or those close to him) was so very present and people simply acted the way they would around him in real life.

By the time Dyan was made mod, Darren and Leo weren't around anymore and with the split the general mood had changed.

What, to this day, I can't understand is how the mood changed towards Darren + Leo mentioning fans in messages or conversations. When Caedn was given "special treatment" at a show, when Dyan was given a mention on TV, when Darren or Leo wrote messages in reply to something which had been posted on the bbs, everyone was cheering and the community was buzzing with excitement because *they* were talking about or to "one of us".
That totally changed and when people were later mentioned there was no happiness for "one of the fans" .. only nasty remarks.

I think things had simply gotten out of control after the split. There was so much hate around, accusations ... much of what has been said must have been extremely hurtful.
I guess all of that played a part.

The fans were disappointed, disillusioned and upset and Darren, who I guess was actually looking for support from us, got blamed and accused of all sorts.
I think it was a hard time for both sides... and yes, I believe that back then it was a case of the fans against Darren and I guess that's what lead to the way things were handled... in general.

Not sure any of this made sense *sighs*

**Dyan** · March 2nd, 2005, 12:45 AM

Yes, but Nic I think that what was lost was the fact that it never was the fans against Darren. And it saddens me to know that the underlying support and acceptance was somehow lost in all the other noise.

You see, I've been sort of mulling this over all day .......... and while I know what Steen meant in her post, I also feel compelled to say that I never did lose my unwavering support of Darren or of the music. Granted other parts of the picture DID shift, and perhaps that's why the support seemed to shift too. But the same strong support that I demonstrated at previous times never changed or lessened.

I also know the same was true for other fans that I talked with. These are the fans who ended up over at the SG fan board (Steen is one, and I hope she doesn't mind my singling her out), and it probably includes many who post here. The thing is that I didn't chat with Kat or those of you who had similar clashes with me, but I have the strong sense that you and she will likely agree with what I'm about to say.......

Yes, there was a lot of misunderstandings about the split and a lot of hurt and even anger about how it was handled. BUT I also know that there was always a strong core of support for Darren and his music.

If people hadn't cared about Darren, then they wouldn't have been so hurt by how things were handled. I just wish in retrospect that had been better understood by all involved at the time.

But then, call me weird, but I have always believed that it is perfectly possible to accept, support and love someone .... yes, unconditionally accept and love ...... and at the same time dislike or disapprove of something they might do or say. I can be flat out furious at someone, but that never changes my feelings toward them.

So if Darren was looking to his fans for a sort of love and acceptance, he only had to see what was right there. Nothing was wanted in return. Nothing was expected or asked. But I know it was there. Even when things seemed at their worst.

**BarbT** · March 2nd, 2005, 01:39 AM

Originally posted by Dyan:

But then, call me weird, but I have always believed that it is perfectly possible to accept, support and love someone .... yes, unconditionally accept and love ...... and at the same time dislike or disapprove of something they might do or say. I can be flat out furious at someone, but that never changes my feelings toward them.

well then you'd better call me weird too [img]smile.gif[/img]

OK so I'm rather exhausted after reading through all this and can identify with many of the things said.

Sharon and in fact everyone, I love to read your posts and really appreciate that you share your thoughts so honestly.

Laurie and Janie..I most certainly understand *sigh*

DH is due home very shortly, once upon a time I would have been excited about that and tuning in to catch any news..not anymore.

I am however finally beginning to feel something special with parts of TTATS. I always seem to skip Popular now because it seems so out of the order and I still cannot get past the beginning of Void. Light is my current obsession

Dyan the unacceptable way your dismissal was handled was a turning point for me and something died at that time. I still believe and hope that one day they will apologise.

**BarbT** · March 2nd, 2005, 01:44 AM

just testing...I know I replied and it says on the front page I did, but LOL where is it [img]confused.gif[/img]

Thread: Is it just me?

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